salmo
Well-known member
I want to run a level mono line from my fly line to when my leader will attach. What diameter mono should I get. Also should I use fluorocarbon? Any advice is greatly appreciated. BTW my fly line is a weight forward #3.
Mono line for Euro Nymphing
- Thread starter salmo
- Start date
Jay_H
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2013
- Messages
- 313
Going ultra-thin for a better Euro-nymphing rig
The fly-fishing systems we employ should draw on our knowledge and streamside experience. The system described below, which focuses on using ultra-thin mono to build a Euro-nymphing rig, was developed based on those two criteria. Everyone’s knowledge and experiences—as well as the water types we...
www.hatchmag.com
There’s George Daniel’s rig if you want something very simple.
I’ve also read a lot of leader designs will use 5lb. Not sure how much difference there is between 5lb to 6lb. But I’m sure either will do.
I typically always use fluorocarbon when nymphing (regardless of style). I like 5x.
Nocktavius
Well-known member
Maxima chameleon 15 lb or Sufix fire (it’s orange) 15 lb gets my vote.
PennKev
Well-known member
- Joined
- Sep 9, 2006
- Messages
- 3,777
Another vote for chameleon, but I cannot say I agree with going as light as George Daniel recommends. 10lb or 8lb is plenty light and is easier to handle. You'll develop your own preference as to what kind, and how thin of line you want.
You mention a "leader" but in this sort of rig you aren't attaching an actual leader as we would typically refer to it. You run a long length of mino from you fly line and the add a sighter directly to the end of the mono, then adding your final tippet and flies to the sighter. You want to avoid having a bunch of knots going through your rod guides and the very long length of one size of chameleon accomplishes this.
You mention a "leader" but in this sort of rig you aren't attaching an actual leader as we would typically refer to it. You run a long length of mino from you fly line and the add a sighter directly to the end of the mono, then adding your final tippet and flies to the sighter. You want to avoid having a bunch of knots going through your rod guides and the very long length of one size of chameleon accomplishes this.
Nocktavius
Well-known member
If you’re not used to fishing mono rigs, you probably don’t want to start with a microthin mono diameter. Especially If you’re coming from a primarily fly line handling/casting background- I’d probably recommend building one with 20 lb (0.022”) Sufix or maxima. Standard practice would be to step down taper it to the terminal tippet ring with a number of different short sections of colorful 12 lb, 10lb, and 1x sighter material. Once you’ve figured out the “casting” (it’s really half actual fly casting and half chucking) you can explore going lighter if you’re not satisfied with the 50+ fish you just vacuumed out of the riffle in front of you.
I’ve settled on 15 lb as my everyday, and occasionally go down to 10 lb in the summer when the bugs get smaller.
I know we’ve talked before about getting out fishing together, so if you’re just looking to start down the dark path of euronymphing I’d be happy to tie you a couple leaders in the style I like to use.
I’ve settled on 15 lb as my everyday, and occasionally go down to 10 lb in the summer when the bugs get smaller.
I know we’ve talked before about getting out fishing together, so if you’re just looking to start down the dark path of euronymphing I’d be happy to tie you a couple leaders in the style I like to use.
Jay_H
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2013
- Messages
- 313
Will say I agree with all of the above. I still fish mono occasionally and typically use a leader build starting at 20lb.
I just figured if you want a light design that is what has been recommended. But there are leader recipes all over the internet.
I just figured if you want a light design that is what has been recommended. But there are leader recipes all over the internet.
Nymph-wristed
Well-known member
+1 on Maxima. It's the OG and the easiest to find. There are others, but they all share the harder, lack of memory qualities. Regular mono will stretch more. You can do it, but it is not optimum.
I typically don't build leaders anymore. Just a straight shot of 30 or 40 feet of Maxima appropriate for the conditions and size of the bugs. 15 lb is a sweet spot, as @Nocktavius shared. I like 12, too, but fishing heavier water with the thinner mono means a short lifetime on the the mono. With 15 lb, I have the same leader to a sighter and tippet ring for a year sometimes (just check for damage once in a while).
I typically don't build leaders anymore. Just a straight shot of 30 or 40 feet of Maxima appropriate for the conditions and size of the bugs. 15 lb is a sweet spot, as @Nocktavius shared. I like 12, too, but fishing heavier water with the thinner mono means a short lifetime on the the mono. With 15 lb, I have the same leader to a sighter and tippet ring for a year sometimes (just check for damage once in a while).
salmo
Well-known member
Hey, thanksNock!
I use 15# Maxima Chameleon to 10# Gold Stren to 4x sighter material to tippet.
Easy-Peazy and very effective.
Easy-Peazy and very effective.
dudemanspecial
Well-known member
For pure nymphing I subscribe to the George Daniel method of 30 feet of 4x running line to 6x tippet. Once you get it down pat you can lob your flies a great distance due to the lack of restriction from a heavier leader. If you are looking for versitility it's not that though.
Shame on anyone nymphing this time of year though. Save that for fall and winter.
Shame on anyone nymphing this time of year though. Save that for fall and winter.
ROVERT
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 25, 2013
- Messages
- 674
I haven't nymphed for a month and a half.
I watched some guys high sticking this weekend while trout were consistently feeding on size 8 mayflies on the surface.
I'm not anti euro but do believe that people who started fly fishing during the euro craze and never bothered to try anything else are truly missing out.
Nymph-wristed
Well-known member
Interesting. I am not disagreeing that dry fly fishing during a hatch is fun and nymphing during a spinner fall is silly. However, I would think it would totally be the other way around as far as the progression.
I am 57 and have fly fished since I was 12 or 13. Most guys I know, myself included, started dry fly fishing and moved to other things. I don't think many enter the sport with a mono rig. YouTube may be skewing perception there, of course, or where we fish. I see way more fishers casting fly lines to their heart's content, not nearly as many nymphing.
Nocktavius
Well-known member
Why wouldn’t one nymph prior to and even during a hatch until they see rising fish surface feeding on emerging bugs, adults or spent spinners? Are dry droppers allowed or do I have to sit on the bank patiently smoking a cigar until it gets too dark to see and we decide the hatch never materialized? If you don’t know your riseforms, you dry or die types are probably wasting 80% of your time casting to fish feeding on nymphs within 12” of the surface.
By the time we both start dry fly fishing, I’ve probably got a 10-20 fish lead. If the “hatch” is a bust (it wasn’t, you just fished it wrong) at least one of us is leaving happy.
Of course this applies to primarily to wild trout.
By the time we both start dry fly fishing, I’ve probably got a 10-20 fish lead. If the “hatch” is a bust (it wasn’t, you just fished it wrong) at least one of us is leaving happy.
Of course this applies to primarily to wild trout.
dudemanspecial
Well-known member
My comment was tongue in cheek. I don't care how you fish. I will nymph this time if year if it gets slow but usually in a more traditional style with fly line and a tapered leader. If we were fishing together and you were up 10-20 fish on me I would be happy for you, I'm not a score keeper. Fish however you get pleasure from it.
ROVERT
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 25, 2013
- Messages
- 674
I'm 44 and started at the same age you did. While my first fish on a fly was taken with an Adams, I spent more time indicator nymphing in the early years than dry fly fishing. This held true until between five and ten years ago.
My progression has been to more dry fly fishing. It is what I enjoy most. That doesn't have to be anyone else's progression. I do believe that many who entered the sport in the last decade to fifteen years primarily nymph whether with fly line or a mono rig. I'm not saying the majority, but many. They are not comfortable fishing dries or wets. I see it stated here and know people who readily admit it. They're missing out just as I would be if I abandoned nymphing.
What I witnessed was guys nymphing when trout were obviously eating duns off the surface. They weren't catching fish. They were missing out. Of course, that is only my perspective.
Why one wouldn't nymph when it is the most effective way comes down to perspective. I gave up counting and always trying to catch the most fish several years ago. I'm happier for it. I catch trout the way I want to. I don't sit on the bank waiting. I walk. I can almost always find some risers in the spring.
I'm a super competitive person but I can say in all honesty that I have no jealousy if someone nymphs up a 10-20 fish lead on me while I'm hunting the shadows for risers. As long as we're both happy with how we did it, fine. If I sounded at all judgemental, I didn't mean it that way. I do find it hard to believe that someone wouldn't prefer to get surface eats when it is most effective. Again, perspective.
1
100%. I've met more than a few "fly fishermen" who can't even cast a line. Ummm...you ain't no fly fisherman if you're a one-trick pony with lobbing a mono rig.
salmo
Well-known member
We are back to the oldest debate in fly fishing. What precisely is the definition of “fly fishing?” I suppose that the term has evolved over the centuries. I started out as an exclusively a dry fly guy. Over the last decade or so I have broadened out to include nymphs, dry dropper and occasional tight line nymphing with multiple flies. This evolution has been partially fueled by my spending more time at my tying desk. I don’t get on the water as much as I would prefer but it’s only a short trip to my tying desk to listen to Gregorian Chant or baseball and using my overly large collection of tying materials. So my personal definition of “fly fishing” includes watching others fish on YouTube, watching videos and listening to blogs on fly tying and the actual process of wetting a line. I’ve used this expression before, “You do you.” I frankly don’t think that debating the definition/method is at all productive. This in MHO.
Nymph-wristed
Well-known member
Maybe it's the success I have with big fish on pressured public water, but I get WAY more questions about how to nymph than I do with how to fish a dry fly over rising fish. I also hate crowds, so I am sometimes gone before most hatch chasers have even gotten up. If I were fishing the same creek as many of you, I would likely be fishing much different water too.
I like the solicitude. Driving to Penns to fish a publicized hatch is just not my cup of tea anymore. Everyone seems to want everyone to fish one way and hates on change. I think the consensus on this site is far from the consensus outside of this microcosm (and linked to the average age of members) and the perception that those that nymph can't do the other things or did not move on from the other things is a limited POV.
Just as many guys give up trout period.
I like the solicitude. Driving to Penns to fish a publicized hatch is just not my cup of tea anymore. Everyone seems to want everyone to fish one way and hates on change. I think the consensus on this site is far from the consensus outside of this microcosm (and linked to the average age of members) and the perception that those that nymph can't do the other things or did not move on from the other things is a limited POV.
Just as many guys give up trout period.
Yeah, but Chris, I am not basing my post above on the perception of guys who only nymph are one-trick ponies; I've seen people first hand on the smallmouth rivers who told me they were avid fly fishermen, and then they couldn't cast a line. Euro-nymphing/tightlining tactics won't get you very far smallmouth fishing. Casting is the name of the game.
At the end of the day, I fish how I want when I want, and I don't begrudge anyone else for fishing how they want and when they want. It's a fun pastime for me. I, too, fish for solitude and peacefulness. I much prefer small stream stealthy fishing; that's my M.O.
Back to leaders, I have seen a split in general leader philosophy. On one hand there is the go as light as possible like the George Daniel option. That is most commonly the 5X leader and 6x tippet and competition guys are more likely to go light. On thing many people do is use a Per Sempe colored material for the leader so it is easier to see. Going this light takes getting used to, but it is my normal option now.
Then there is the fine leaders are a tangling mess and who needs to go that small side and they go with 8 lbs to 30 lbs mono. Everyone has their favorite. I like 8 lbs Maxima when I go heavier. When I go really heavy like for steelhead I use a fluorescent green 30 lbs (the lightest) OPST Lazar Line which I can see from 100 yds away - it is the brightest line I know. Going heavier may be easier to get used to, but lose a little sensitivity and wind resistance IMHO.
That said, basic leader is simple: 10's of ft of leader, sighter, tippet of 3 ft to say 5 ft. In some fly fishing areas or Great Lakes tribs leader design may be affected be rules. Any rig will be legal in general regs areas, but fishing on Salmon R leader and tippet limited to 15', for an example.
Then there is the fine leaders are a tangling mess and who needs to go that small side and they go with 8 lbs to 30 lbs mono. Everyone has their favorite. I like 8 lbs Maxima when I go heavier. When I go really heavy like for steelhead I use a fluorescent green 30 lbs (the lightest) OPST Lazar Line which I can see from 100 yds away - it is the brightest line I know. Going heavier may be easier to get used to, but lose a little sensitivity and wind resistance IMHO.
That said, basic leader is simple: 10's of ft of leader, sighter, tippet of 3 ft to say 5 ft. In some fly fishing areas or Great Lakes tribs leader design may be affected be rules. Any rig will be legal in general regs areas, but fishing on Salmon R leader and tippet limited to 15', for an example.
