Tulpehocken, Berks County, 06/12/2010

The tully is easy, unless you dedicate yourself to catching the midge sippers, and even then it's not that hard.

But it did teach me a lot. It's the first and only place that I fished hatches for a long time. I still have a soft spot for spending a late spring evening casting to risers at the water works.

I'm just not that in to stocked fish these days, and I moved away from the area. It's not worth the ride to get there. If I am in the area (still have family there), I check out one of the dozens of wild trout streams on my list. And there sure are tons of wild trout opportunities in that area. It's one of the better regions outside of central and NC PA.

The habitat is below marginal, and the only area that I really find pretty is the pallisades. /shrug. If I still lived in the area, I'd probably fish it now and then... but I'd probably still be in contact with a few of my old exes too. :-D
 
salvelinusfontinalis wrote:
There is one simple reason for all the trash talk about the Tully. It is very challenging to fish. If you aren't changing flys or getting a good drift or matching the hatch it is very easy to get skunked! Yes it does get crowded at the honey holes but there is plenty of other water to fish. I have always said if you can consistently catch trout on the Tully you can fish anywhere.
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Now I have always said that if you can catch fish in the Letort, then you can catch fish anywhere. Not everyone that can catch fish in the Tully can catch them in the Letort.
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I stand corrected you are right about the Letort Sal. 🙂

I am sure that some people on this board find the Tully (yawn) not challenging or easy. Obviously the more time you spend there the easier it is. But I would be willing to bet most people who bash it really have trouble figuring it out. It is a challenge especially at certain times of the year to catch fish for the average fly guy. Now if you can spank em on the Tully you are probably capable of spanking em Just About anywhere :lol:
 
If catching fish is the goal, a globug is tough to beat. San juans and other junk flies too. If all else fails, a zebra midge works 99% of the time.

That ain't too difficult.

Most days, I'd have a dozen fish in a few hours doing that.

You can make it tough by choosing to fish certain ways, but it's almost always easy to catch fish there.
 
You can make it tough by choosing to fish certain ways, but it's almost always easy to catch fish there.
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Best answer I've heard and it applies to every stream in PA.

Certain streams are never easy (the Tully definately isn't in this catagory), but if catching a fish or two is a goal there's always a way.
 
When your box if filled with #12-14 red quills, stoneflies and stuff like that.... the Tully is really tough!

I had a box that was just for the Tully. Several hundred caddis adults, larva and pupa. If you ever find it, I'd like to have it back. I think I left it on the roof of my car when fishing upstate and drove away. Insert Homer Simpson... DUH!
 
A few things.

Yes, I trash talk the Tully. No, it is not difficult. Haven't fished it in a while, but 10ish was usually a pretty average day during the spring. Sometimes you get held to 5 or so, but sometimes you get 15-20 too, so it evens out. I've been skunked exactly twice, both of them winter days. In the winter I lower my expectations, 3 or 4 is a decent day. And when the water gets consistently above 70 in the summer I don't fish it, so I can't tell ya there.

As for why the fishermen only go to the name holes? Simple, thats where the fish are. 95% of the Tully is poor water and the fish congregate in the few decent holding areas, which of course get names because they're better than other places. That doesn't mean you can't pick up a fish or two elsewhere, just that you're not gonna find that congregation of em.

Yes, Mike is correct about the special regs, though. Some of the stream's best water is found outside of the special reg area, and it gets largely ignored by the FF community. It took me some time to learn that but its true. By the way, even the ATW area is open year round, don't have to wait until opening day. And it doesn't get fished out as much as you think it does.

Mike is also correct that there are plenty of other good streams in the area, whether you like stockies or wilds. It's far from the only game in town. The only reason I ever go there now is that I live 3 minutes away. Even at that, I haven't fished the Tully this year since April. I fished it dozens of times at prime time each of the previous 3 years and have nothing really against it, but now that I'm learning the area it seems to just keep falling down my list.

As for, I think it was Bert, that there were "only" 3 or 4 guys at the refrigerator hole. That is a one person hole, maybe 2 if they're together, but I'd certainly never try to move into that hole if a stranger already occupied it. 3 or 4 is definitely "crowded", even if you are including the long flat above that. Reber's, likewise. I stop and look from the bridge. 1 guy in sight? Ok, I'd rather be alone but I can find a place to get in without bothering him. 2 guys? Thats pushing it, depends how they're set up. 3 guys? No way, too crowded for me, I'll go elsewhere.
 
There are a good number of trout the entire stretch of stream...trust me. It's common for most guys to congregate around the well known holes since they have easy access. I've done well anywhere there is water on the Tully. Granted some places are better than others...

Ron
 
I have found extensive stretches of "dead" water, but there are areas between access points that can be productive. I consider that the exception rather than the rule, but it's still worth exploring.

In my few years on the tully, I found that the majority of the fish are at the easy access points, especially since the adult stockings started.
 
I know some that DO catch a pile of trout on the Tully but when they go to the Delaware.... ZIPPO. So much for that theory.
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Hey, hey, hey! Now stop it! I take that personally! LOL!

I prove the Letort point as well.

I suck and/or Tully is easy.

BTW, the water coming OUT OF THE DAM was 72 degrees today. I agree with Sal, ya can't even really call it a tail water! I am cautiously optimistic about the adult stocking program. Again, IF there is a good holdover through the Summer AND Fall 2010, Spring 2011 stocking are as scheduled, then Spring 2011 should produce quality and quantity. I would not travel an hour to fish the Tully, but it's not a bad resource to have 15 minutes from my house. Easy for the morning/evening trip.

I do have one question. Why is it that Penns is off limits because it is too warm and C&R will stress the fish, yet there is no real caution being thrown around for the Tully which is every bit as warm as Penns?
 
Because the trout in Penns are wild, therefore stand to live their entire life in the stream. They literally provide a full lifetime of enjoyment. One dies, and it takes another to be naturally born within the stream to replace it. With the tully, it's just a matter of waiting for the white truck to return.

The fish in the tully are stocked to be harvested, due to the conditions. The local culture may have deviated from that ends, but it's still the case.

While penns has thermal issues, it also has amazing habitat, and many feeder/thermal refuge streams. The tully has practically none and two respectively. The tully has provided me with tons of enjoyment, but it's just a glorified put and take.

I would love to see the tully stay cooler, undergo habitat restoration, and eventually be made c&r fingerling stocked, but it ain't happening.

As I've said, I don't fish the tully when it's warm... but due to the above, I don't lose sleep when people do.
 
The Tully has changed quite a lot since Blue Marsh Dam was built. Shortly after the dam was built, me and a handful of other fly fisherman realized there was a potential for a trout fishery there. This area was not a trout fishery before the dam was built. So we decided the best way to collectively help the stream and have some direction was to form a Trout Unlimited chapter. We met at a local diner and the Berks County Chapter of Trout Unlimited was born. The name was later changed to the Tulpehocken Chapter. I served on the board for a number of years.

We worked with the Fish Commission to evaluate the stream and construct stream improvement devices. The chapter raised trout to stock the creek (at a hatchery in Robesonia) and another fellow and I built the first float boxes to stock the Tully. I remember the first time we stocked it and the truck was late arriving. Stumbled down the creek in the dark because we didn't know the stream structure yet. Then the Fish Commission agreed to make it a DHALO project. It actually exended below the covered bridge to include 2 nice riffles and pools, but was later shortened to end at the bridge.

The stream was first stocked with adult trout. Then Mike Kaufman decided to try stocking fingerlings in the fall. The fingerlings were actually longer than fingerling size. The success was amazing. The fish became fat and fast by spring. And 2 year old fish were fairly abundant. When you hooked an 18" rainbow with 7X tippet, all you could do was point your rod and hope. Fishing pressure was fairly light during the first couple of years, and with a little knowledge you could readily take 25-30 fish during a morning's hatch. Or have one of those 50+ days.

So now we're back to stocking adult trout, and some of the holding water has degraded. A prime example it the long pool above the Palisades. It looks like a carp flat now with an island.
Perhaps more work can be done to improve it. I don't know what, if anything is planned by TU or any other organization. Maybe some of the people who complain about the condition of the creek should step up to the plate like we did and do something about it.

One thing I do not understand is the fish location this year. Some runs/pools are loaded with fish while a lot of other good holding water is seemingly void of fish.

So there you go, I thought you might like to hear some history of the DHALO and my thoughts. My biggest complaint? Stream Etiquette.
 
Thanks outsider. That was some really good info. It's always nice to hear personal experience the history about a fishery from people like yourself.
 
With all of the issues about water depth and temperatures, what about the obvious solution of increasing the water flow from the dam?

(Now, I say that knowing there is an answer for this, but it drives me a little nuts every year. . . )
 
Thanks for the info.... it was very interesting to hear the history. I was unaware but fish this stream pretty often.

When you talk about stream etiquette what do you mean? Any examples? Anyone is welcomed to chime in. I actually had some guy tell me that he was starting to feel rain drops on his head basically implying that I was wading too heavily. I was walking along the backside nowhere that was even close to where people were fishing and I definitely was not wading too heavily. The guy was just being a jerk and it was pretty pathetic considering he was fishing the water works stretch one of the most pressured stretches of stream where people like to get in and out of the water. I guess the guy expected to me to climb up one of the cliffs and not take the stairs? I certainly am not going to take the so called trail through the woods either. I did that once at the Tully and totally destroyed a pair of waders with the briar bushes being so numerous. Sorry, just had to vent a little bit.
 
Maybe it's just me, but when you look past many of the tully's downfalls, it has a certain charm about it. And even though you're fishing for stocked fish, it is still very enjoyable.
 
NedZeppelin wrote:
With all of the issues about water depth and temperatures, what about the obvious solution of increasing the water flow from the dam?

(Now, I say that knowing there is an answer for this, but it drives me a little nuts every year. . . )
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At this point, that would amount to pumping more 73 degree water. Also, the dam was made for a few reasons, none of which were to create a fishery. It's a nice perk, but as you can see from the above, it was just a bonus. I don't really expect the corps to marginalize the effect of other, originally intended uses.

The cold water reserves in blue marsh just aren't enough to maintain a cold fishery year 'round... but I could be wrong. I don't think there's an issue with heavy releases exhausting the cold water supply earlier in the year, but I'd be curious to hear from the tailwater guys about that. I know they open 'er up now and then, but it's usually due to issues like flood control and salinity of the delaware bay (another intended use of the dam).

The lake would have to be made deeper, and I don't see that happening.
 
With all of the issues about water depth and temperatures, what about the obvious solution of increasing the water flow from the dam?
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It's not about the amount of water, its about the amount of COLD water! High and warm does you no good either. My understanding (and it could be wrong since I've never heard it from the Army Corps guys) is that the dam is capable of taking cold water from deep and warm water from the top and mixing it how they see fit. Unfortunately, the deep, cold pocket in the lake is not all that big, so each year you only have so much of that cold water available. So if you shoot out cold water at a high rate, you run out of cold water earlier in the summer, and you're left with warm water temps in the late summer and trout have very little chance to hold over. So, instead, they ration the cold water. They pull it all from the top until it gets too warm, and then add cold water a little at a time to keep the water temperature just under lethal. Hopefully, in a cool year, you'll get through the summer.

But that deep water pocket is filling in and getting a bit smaller every year, and thats the base of the issue that the Tully faces. It gets harder and harder to supply enough cold water to last the summer. You could dredge it, but that carries no advantage for anyone but fishermen, so it'd have to be fishermen funded. The other option is to give up on the year-round fishery, which seems to be the direction we're headed. It can still be a fine put and take fishery in the spring, and heck, its not a bad warmwater fishery either.

As for holding water, yeah, there's a lot of "dead" or almost dead stretches. Like I said, that doesn't mean you can't go through there at certain times and pick up a fish or two. Most of the better holding areas are well known, though they're not all right at access points. Since the adult stockings started, I've noticed that the fish have been more concentrated at access points than before.
 
Stream Etiquette. People fishing too close to each other. Someone moved in on me recently and caught my line. I let him know how unhappy I was about that.

I agree about water temp vs. flow to a point. Moving water means more oxygen, right? I'd rather fish a high, fast moving 72 degree stream than a low, still stream.
 
outsider wrote:
Stream Etiquette. People fishing too close to each other. Someone moved in on me recently and caught my line. I let him know how unhappy I was about that.

I agree about water temp vs. flow to a point. Moving water means more oxygen, right? I'd rather fish a high, fast moving 72 degree stream than a low, still stream.
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The higher water would mean less effect from the cooling tribs, though... right?

Then again, if it's moving faster, the sun might warm it less.

I'm not sure how that dynamic would work, but I'm skeptical that any benefit would come from increasing flows.
 
"When you talk about stream etiquette what do you mean? Any examples? Anyone is welcomed to chime in. I actually had some guy tell me that he was starting to feel rain drops on his head basically implying that I was wading too heavily. I was walking along the backside nowhere that was even close to where people were fishing and I definitely was not wading too heavily. The guy was just being a jerk and it was pretty pathetic considering he was fishing the water works stretch one of the most pressured stretches of stream where people like to get in and out of the water. I guess the guy expected to me to climb up one of the cliffs and not take the stairs? I certainly am not going to take the so called trail through the woods either. I did that once at the Tully and totally destroyed a pair of waders with the briar bushes being so numerous. Sorry, just had to vent a little bit."

Wading behind someone in the stream at the Tully isn't a problem, sometimes you have to. I just let them know I'm going to pass behind them. Spook the fish? You can stand on their back's there and they won't be spooked.
 
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