News about the "Yellow House" stretch on the LJ

[tomgamber]

Rich people do good things too. I think we should be as hostile to him as possible so that he understands who he is preserving it for.- obvious sarcasm.

I belive there was mention of a conversation where the buyer doesn't rule out some kind of access.
I also believe that the rather obvious irony pointed out by dudeman was done with sarcasm.
Interesting how defensive some have become.

 

[PennKev]

This will be a great section of river for the motivated amongst us to go and fish, be it by foot, boat, helicopter, whatever.

 

[dudemanspecial]

What did you do to protect the land?

That has anything to do with what?

Why shouldn’t he enjoy it and control access and still have conservative in mind?

I word for word said that he is free to do so in my post. I'm just pointing out the irony and arrogance of the situation. I hope he does give an easement, if he doesn't oh well. Maybe he didn't know who he was bidding against, but having been through my share of auctions, I bet the farm he did.

Stop chirping from the sidelines

You're not my boss.

 

[Nymph-wristed]

I appreciate the efforts. Does this mean that LJRA still has that money to fight the next fight? This trend is far from over....

Also, I am sure "Dave" won't see you on his tract if you happen to be there by accident and if you're out of there before 9:30 AM 😛

 

[jifigz]

People have the right to purchase land and do what is they want to do within the parameters of the law on said purchased land. However, land falling into private citizens' hands has a much higher percentage of being posted or privatized vs a more public entity having ownership. People don't seem to be as caring and kind with access to their lands as they once did. Talk to the old timers about hunting and whatnot and how it used to be compared to now. Trout streams are no different. When too much land and access is gobbled up by private citizens without concern for allowing the average person on to fish or hunt, we've essentially gone the way of Europe and are now a pay-to-play setup. That ain't cool. We need to secure public access to our woods and waters. Luckily, PA has a lot of state forests and state game lands, but the majority of our prime waters lie on private land.

 

[CinnamonJoe]

People have the right to purchase land and do what is they want to do within the parameters of the law on said purchased land. However, land falling into private citizens' hands has a much higher percentage of being posted or privatized vs a more public entity having ownership. People don't seem to be as caring and kind with access to their lands as they once did. Talk to the old timers about hunting and whatnot and how it used to be compared to now. Trout streams are no different. When too much land and access is gobbled up by private citizens without concern for allowing the average person on to fish or hunt, we've essentially gone the way of Europe and are now a pay-to-play setup. That ain't cool. We need to secure public access to our woods and waters. Luckily, PA has a lot of state forests and state game lands, but the majority of our prime waters lie on private land.

Deer hunting here in Iowa is basically 'pay to play', and it sucks-well, if you can't get on private land, it does. Many other places out west for big game as well; though thankfuly the big ranchers and Ted Turners can't buy all of it, yet. Almost to a 'T', these private lands get leased to outfitters and you need deep pockets if you want access. No bueno. Well stated, Josh.

Joe

 

[tjsingle]

Hopefully some sort of easement can be secured. Whether that be PFBC, LJRA, or whatever consortium of groups. Maybe like an Erie Tribs type deal.

I could be wrong but I'd imagine it's difficult for the state agencies to pony up money for property acquisition without including it in their FY budget or plan.

The more public lands the better, in my opinion.

 

[Swattie87]

People have the right to purchase land and do what is they want to do within the parameters of the law on said purchased land. However, land falling into private citizens' hands has a much higher percentage of being posted or privatized vs a more public entity having ownership. People don't seem to be as caring and kind with access to their lands as they once did. Talk to the old timers about hunting and whatnot and how it used to be compared to now. Trout streams are no different. When too much land and access is gobbled up by private citizens without concern for allowing the average person on to fish or hunt, we've essentially gone the way of Europe and are now a pay-to-play setup. That ain't cool. We need to secure public access to our woods and waters. Luckily, PA has a lot of state forests and state game lands, but the majority of our prime waters lie on private land.

Good morrow fine sir. I do believe I reserved a 9:30 castoff time for this here beat for this upcoming fortnight. Do I need to call the pro shop? (Read it in a British accent.)

 

[bdhoover77]

As much as it stinks that a conservancy group could not have purchased the property, I suppose it’s better that an individual who is potentially open to the idea of a fishing easement now owns the property rather than Homewaters Club or some similar organization.

Whether the buyer will actually grant a fishing easement remains to be seen.

Regarding the comparison to Europe, the irony is that private golf clubs in the UK are MUCH more welcoming to visitors and outside play than private golf clubs in the US. Yes, you pay more than members and their guests, but UK clubs generally have are very welcoming to outside visitor play. It keeps the costs low for the local members. The same cannot be said for US clubs, which are much more restrictive.

 

[CinnamonJoe]

As much as it stinks that a conservancy group could not have purchased the property, I suppose it’s better that an individual who is potentially open to the idea of a fishing easement now owns the property rather than Homewaters Club or some similar organization.

Whether the buyer will actually grant a fishing easement remains to be seen.

Regarding the comparison to Europe, the irony is that private golf clubs in the UK are MUCH more welcoming to visitors and outside play than private golf clubs in the US. Yes, you pay more than members and their guests, but UK clubs generally have are very welcoming to outside visitor play. It keeps the costs low for the local members. The same cannot be said for US clubs, which are much more restrictive.

Recently saw some fly fishing documentaries/blogs where the authors were fishing 'club' or 'association' water in the UK & Ireland and; honestly, I was surprised to see that it was a much more affordable/accessible/inclusive situation than I thought. What they showed more looked like the situation @ the IWL chapter I am a member of, where I get access to their rifle range, but instead over in England, club members got access to the trout stream; guests allowed, etc, visitors for a reasonable fee. The associations had river keepers, biologists hired to help maintain the stream/members also worked on stream habitat projects Granted, not all streams in the UK probably are that easy going.

Still, I firmly am in the camp of maintaining/expanding public access to game fish resources, anti 'pay to play'.

Lest we forget we fought a war 250 yrs ago for INDEPENDENCE from the King/UK! LOL

Joe

 

[nymphingmaniac]

Hopefully some sort of easement can be secured. Whether that be PFBC, LJRA, or whatever consortium of groups. Maybe like an Erie Tribs type deal.

I could be wrong but I'd imagine it's difficult for the state agencies to pony up money for property acquisition without including it in their FY budget or plan.

The more public lands the better, in my opinion.

Easements only granted by PFBC. They also determine value and what they are willing to put into the easement.
Organizations like LJRA are the boots on the ground who identify, approach and sell the idea to landowners- at least it worked that way at the J. Can't say about Erie or other locations. Money for easements is rarely the problem. The bottleneck is identifying and getting landowners open to the idea of granting an easement. This often involves multiple approaches and relationships. Put simply, LJRA (Bill) did the hard work, and PFBC are the closers, obviously a super important role of providing the money and legal assistance and enforcement.
This is the model that others could follow too. Also, I believe PFBC would be willing to accept funds to be applied toward easement acquisition. I'm not saying give to easements broadly; that's a real tough ask. I bet you could tie it to a particular stretch of your favorite stream.

 

[nymphingmaniac]

As much as it stinks that a conservancy group could not have purchased the property, I suppose it’s better that an individual who is potentially open to the idea of a fishing easement now owns the property rather than Homewaters Club or some similar organization.

Whether the buyer will actually grant a fishing easement remains to be seen.

Regarding the comparison to Europe, the irony is that private golf clubs in the UK are MUCH more welcoming to visitors and outside play than private golf clubs in the US. Yes, you pay more than members and their guests, but UK clubs generally have are very welcoming to outside visitor play. It keeps the costs low for the local members. The same cannot be said for US clubs, which are much more restrictive.

I wasn't there but was told others at the auction represented commercial interests. So, as I wrote in other thread, not the best case, but certainly not the worst.

 

[tjsingle]

Easements only granted by PFBC. They also determine value and what they are willing to put into the easement.
Organizations like LJRA are the boots on the ground who identify, approach and sell the idea to landowners- at least it worked that way at the J. Can't say about Erie or other locations. Money for easements is rarely the problem. The bottleneck is identifying and getting landowners open to the idea of granting an easement. This often involves multiple approaches and relationships. Put simply, LJRA (Bill) did the hard work, and PFBC are the closers, obviously a super important role of providing the money and legal assistance and enforcement.
This is the model that others could follow too. Also, I believe PFBC would be willing to accept funds to be applied toward easement acquisition. I'm not saying give to easements broadly; that's a real tough ask. I bet you could tie it to a particular stretch of your favorite stream.

Thank you for the clarification, I always wondered how that worked.

 

[Nocktavius]

At least the LJ was ruled navigable so regardless of who bought the land, they couldn’t have kept you out of the river below the high water mark (lotta floodplain out there too so that line is a lot further up the bank than most people think).

Seems like a decent dude and as far as bidding against a conservancy maybe he was under the impression that they would try to limit fishing or something… ultimately doesn’t matter bc I’ll still be fishing the river through his property anyway due to the aforementioned ruling 😆

 

[troutbert]

At least the LJ was ruled navigable so regardless of who bought the land, they couldn’t have kept you out of the river below the high water mark (lotta floodplain out there too so that line is a lot further up the bank than most people think).

Navigable river status does not give the public access to the floodplain.

It gives access within the channel. The mean annual high water mark is approximately equal to top of bank.

If you're walking across the floodplain, you're trespassing.

 

[Shawn_H]

Certainly glad it’s not homewaters