Mud Run, Carbon County,4/6/2012

[Lonewolve]

if you could get further down on the Greystone water youd be into yer eyeballs with fish.

 

[k-bob]

For the heck of it, I pushed a long way up fourth run yesterday. Even in the middle of our current heat wave, water temperatures were excellent, about 56 at 9 am. The pH also seemed to be okay, about 7 on fourth run at the confluence with black creek, and about 6.8 three quarters of a mile upstream on fourth. The holes, structure, and water level seem to be fine. I did catch a few small wild brown trout, but the fish population didn't seem to be good for such a remote stream section. I doubt the issue is either fishing pressure or development. Great hike in a remote area. But some other streams in the area seem to have a lot more brown trout than fourth run, even a mile up from hayes/black. Several reports note that fishing was better on fourth and hayes/black below 80 about 15 to 20 years ago, for ex., lonewolve and the wolfe book. ??

 

[Lonewolve]

K-bob,
great post, i stand by my word that hayes used to fish far better an there were more brookies than browns.water temps still the same, good clean mountain water, except i think there was trouble years ago with some sewage gettin in but i fished that stream many times after that an it still very good numbers.its been about 7 years since i fished there because the last time i was there the fishing had dropped like a rock ,i went back a fewweeeks later after that during a cooler period same things and also didnt learn so i went a week later{early September} an this was during a low pressure drizzly misty day for 8 hrs an worked hard i caught four fish three brooks one brown,water temps were excellent,lifted rocks an there were good number of nymphs although small for that time of year.

It isnt what it was and thats a shame because it sure as hell aint caused by overdevelopment. I sometimes suspect that rt 80 runoff has compromised it, especially the salt in the winter.Can't be certain. I am no chemist.
Pm me when you plan on going next time, mybe we can meet up an check it out.
Tight Wraps & Tight Lines
Rick Wallace

 

[CLSports]

I agree with everyone else here that Hickory, Mud and Hayes are not that good anymore. The last time I fished Hickory from the park office down to the Lehigh River last year and did not even see a fish. I also turned over many rocks along the way and they were all devoid of any insect life. It is a shame. There are good brookie stream very nearby, so I do not know what has happened to these particular streams . . .

 

[PhilC]

I was only there once, and it was more a scouting mission in the early season, so I didn't expect much...

Kinda sucks if you're set on trout fishing this area, the river is too hot this time of year and stream like these aren't doing well...

 

[Lonewolve]

Hickory run is a joke IMHO, last year there was sewage in the creek from the state park treatment plant an i mean it looked like muddy water...was really sad.Considering the state park is supposed to be ecologically minded. They should just go back to the outhouses and have a big septic tank sytem.The park system barely has funds to maintain the park let alone manage a treatment plant

 

[SBecker]

I do know this year WPTU will be working with the fish commission on these streams (electroshocking) to try to begin to identify the problem.

 

[PoconoPaul]

SBecker wrote:
I do know this year WPTU will be working with the fish commission on these streams (electroshocking) to try to begin to identify the problem.

I'll also add that we are going to host a CCC training session in October on the 13th and anyone is welcome to attend. Will follow with details when everything comes together. This training will provide us with the particulars and tools for gathering baseline data on water quality.

 

[Stoned_Fly]

Fished Hayes and Hickory on the 21st and 22nd of July. Lucked out with 70 degree weather. Water temp was 59 on Hayes. Temp on Hickory 58. Both streams produced dbl digits. Hayes was all browns. Hickory all brookies. Covered about 1.25 on Hayes and 1 mile on Hickory. I visit this area several times a year for the past several years and both streams have been very good to me. As for Mud run I have only ever caught one fish there just above where Hawk Falls flows into mud which was 3 years ago - a 3 inch brownie and since then gave up fishing it. I have seen several small fish rising in the deep pool on the bend just above hawk falls as well, but never had much luck there.

 

[jackmac613]

I was hunting for a discussion on this subject tonite, and I found this one. I have fished Mud Run since 1971 and Hayes and Hickory from around 1980 to the early '90s. I can attest to how good they were during those years. This year I went into Hayes and Hickory for the first time since the '90s and I saw no sign of trout in either. I didn't see much insect life either. They all used to be great for both wild brooks and browns.

I continued to fish Mud Run thru 2004, when hurricane Ivan seemed to have a devastating effect on it. In my favorite spot at the time (down the mountain trail from the old Organized Group camping area) Ivan had churned-up some very big rocks from the bottom and put them in a pile that blocked the main stem of Mud and rechanneled it to flow thru what had been a very small side stem. It was a wonder to see what nature could do, but it sure ruined the fishing. I started fishing Mud Run again about three years ago and it seemed to be coming back. But after the big storm last year it appeared to be fishless again.

Has anyone discussed how these major storms might have affected Hickory and Hayes? When I used to fish Hickory it was always down below the Park office down toward the river. At the time I believed Hickory held bigger wild fish than Mud Run. I mostly fished Hayes up above Fourth Run and it had plenty of both wild Brook and Brown. This year I was into all those old spots.

This week I'm going to try Mud Run above Hawk Falls and Hickory Run upstream around Saylorsville.

 

[vcregular]

Discussions about the lack of fish in these streams has been an ongoing one for quite a while. No one seems to know what the story is, other than the fish (and bugs for that matter) don't seem to be there like they've been in the past.

 

[Twentyofive]

I'm not a fly guy (spinners and spoons here) but I fish Mud Run about once every three weeks or so. Fall, Winter and Spring I tend to see the most amount of fish. The fish are incredibly picky and almost maddening to get to hit. The sections I work have never produced a limit (keep or release) however the fish I do land have all been near trophy size. Brookies, Brownies and Tigers all bigger than 18 inches which keep me going back in hopes of the day they happen to be aggressively feeding. If I want to catch a lot of fish I go else where. If I want to try for a big fish I stop here.

 

[SBecker]

Lmao, not even a good troll.

 

[Kabutt]

I caught an 18" 'bow in Mud Run once.

 

[homeontheroad]

I know this discussion is over a year old at this point, but i figured i would share some encouraging news regarding the wild trout populations in some of the streams being discussed. I, as well as most everyone else who has posted, has had little luck on Mud Run (just 1 decent Brookie upstream of the confluence with Panther Creek and no more). However, I fished Hawk Run last winter and caught roughly 15 wild browns and brookies (all legal size) from the confluence with Mud Run up to RT 534. In fact, there is a nice little pool on Hawk Run about 2-3 feet deep and 20 ft long just on the North side of 534, in which at one point there was a surprisingly large cache of young brookies - i would say upwards of 30-40 fish. I stop there occasionally just to see if they are still present, and they are, just not as many (I would assume easy targets for heron and other wildlife, and not very well hidden or off the beaten path). I have also caught a couple of wild browns (very dark coloration) on Panther Creek within 100 yards of Mud Run. The largest brown I caught in the area was in the upper plunge pool of Hawk Falls - a VERY yellow brown trout roughly 12 inches.

I also fished Black Creek last winter from RT 534 to Fourth and only saw one fish darting away as i approached. No hook ups. From what ive read this apparently used to hold some very nice wild trout, many in the 14-20in range. Im sure many people read the PFBC biologist report that shared this info and had their way with it.

I would like to know if anyone has fished Mud Run downstream of the TPK. On satellite views, it appears that there is a decent sized waterfall about 2 miles down from the TPK bridge (halfway between the bridge and fishing club further down), but i cant find any info on these falls. Seeing as this is a pretty steep gorge and fairly innaccessible, i would assume the fishing pressure is not as great in this section. Anyone have any feedback on this section of stream? This is just outside of what appears to be SP boundries, so maybe it is just private and unfishable?

 

[salvelinus]

homeontheroad, check your PMs.

 

[JohnPowers]

Sterile...nothing alive. Just kidding. I've done quite well casting henyville specials in the little pokets in the riffles upstream from the falls in mud run over the years. A Reasonably fit person should have no access problems. Not the easy access like valley creek but then there's nothing alive in there either.

 

[outsider]

vcregular wrote:
Discussions about the lack of fish in these streams has been an ongoing one for quite a while. No one seems to know what the story is, other than the fish (and bugs for that matter) don't seem to be there like they've been in the past.

I fished Mud Run since the 70's, never witnessed prolific hatches. Why? Don't know. And I was never impressed with the trout population.

 

[wgmiller]

homeontheroad wrote:
I also fished Black Creek last winter from RT 534 to Fourth and only saw one fish darting away as i approached. No hook ups. From what ive read this apparently used to hold some very nice wild trout, many in the 14-20in range. Im sure many people read the PFBC biologist report that shared this info and had their way with it.

There's been some pretty extensive discussion on here about Black/Hayes recently. Just do a search and you should dig up the threads. I believe the latest discussion was around electroshocking and confirmation that there are actually fish in there, although they may be higher up in the waterway where access is, ummm, difficult at best.