Kettle Creek, Potter Co, May 19-22, 2016

[Prospector]

Water was low and clear when we arrived on Thursday. By Sunday it still was clear but the slow 30 hour rain appeared to help. Had Pale Evening Dun, March Browns, Little Sulphurs, BWO, Green Drakes, caddis and several other mayflies mixed in. The fish were not particularly selective when rising but the colder mornings seemed to keep water temps lower and any fish that worked didn't start until afternoon. The dry fly fishing should have been better based on the amount of insects available. We had to go subsurface more than we would have liked due to rain and lack of rising fish. But we got a decent amount on dries.

FFO section had 21 vehicles on Saturday (probably the most I've ever seen) and that was preceded on Friday night with at least 3 people bringing lawn chairs to stake out a fishing spot for the evening. That seemed a little silly and certainly left a bad taste. So we only fished the FFO on Thursday and Friday morn/afternoon. We spent Friday evening and all day Sat plus Sun morning on the open water. I prefer being alone and we caught a decent amount of fish. Our group landed 157 over about 13 "fishing days"......12 per day.

If you stop by the Kettle Creek tackle shop inquire about signing the petition to establish a C&R area on Kettle Creek between Trout Run and Beaverdam run (essentially Liedy bridge is close to the center).

 

[Swattie87]

Thanks for the report. Looks like overall it fished well for you. I didn’t make it up this Spring. Combination of work, a bad month long cold, and a back injury.

The lawn chair thing isn't really that odd, in theory anyway. For the primo Spring hatches on the big, popular, Central PA limestoners a similar thing happens, without the chairs perhaps though. Guys get there early ahead of the evening hatch, well before there’s much surface activity usually, and stake out a piece of water they’d like to fish for the evening. I do this. I don’t take a chair, I just sit on a rock or log usually…have something to drink, eat a snack, take a nap sometimes. I have my rod rigged up, and if I see someone eyeing up the same water I wade out and start casting. I was there first, I'm just choosing to not disturb the fish in that stretch until the hatch proper starts if I don't have to...I try to just sit on the bank until the action heats up. It’s part of the game on these types of streams, and the big NC freestoners (like Kettle, and especially its FFO stretch) are probably similar in this regard. Most times I’ve found though (with perhaps the exception of Penns sometimes) that if the bugs show up, the fish do too, and there’s plenty of rising fish to go around and keep everyone occupied. Makes you not mind as much having other guys relatively close to you, closer than would otherwise be acceptable outside of a nice hatch anyway.

 

[Prospector]

I agree with you that staking claim to a piece of water happens. To me the difference is the chair. At the little league baseball game the chair fits, but a chair sitting on a gravel bar of the lovely trout stream is just an eye sore to me. A fisherman sitting on a log, rock or bank is fine. I resolved it by not fishing there which seemed to work well for both him and me.

 

[Van_Cleaver]

This brings back some great memories for me. Several years ago I fished the "horseshoe" on Kettle for the first time on two consecutive evenings. The first night I fished my way down and then noticed the swarms of Green Drakes above. I has been nymphing and had a couple but I stopped and sat on the bank. The spinners dropped and fish rose everywhere. Managed about eight on caddis patterns; they didn't like any of my spinner patterns. This was early June and there were several hatches going on. All the fish were fat rainbows the smallest about 13". The next night I went back about 7:30 or so, Two anglers were whipping the bottom of the pool to a froth with no apparent luck. I smiled and sat down mid pool (no lawn chair)where I had fished previously, They left a little after eight and shortly after I noticed the swarms gathering. Suddenly as though a string had been cut the helicopters dropped. Rises were imediate and numerous. Probably caught a similar no. as the first night, but I was using my favorite 3 wt. and the fish were a little larger. Yes they were left over stockers, but feisty and up to about 18". Highlight was near blind casting to rise and hooking a very nice trout when it was way too dark to see my fly.

 

[troutbert]

Prospector wrote:
I agree with you that staking claim to a piece of water happens. To me the difference is the chair. At the little league baseball game the chair fits, but a chair sitting on a gravel bar of the lovely trout stream is just an eye sore to me. A fisherman sitting on a log, rock or bank is fine. I resolved it by not fishing there which seemed to work well for both him and me.

Some use lawn chairs.

Some use flagging tape to mark their "beat."

 

[bigjohn58]

Whoa...can anyone give me more info on this C&R petition on Kettle from Trout Run to Beaver Dam? Personally seems like a joke to me.

 

[Prospector]

All I know about the proposed C&R is they have secured lots of signatures (maybe over 1000) and have lots of support from various groups. They are selling pins and I've seen people wearing the pins on the stream. This has been in the works for a few years but wasn't quite so public until now.

Trout Run to Beaverdam is a fairly long stretch with the Liedy area getting the majority of the pressure. Above and below Liedy is very lightly fished since it requires some walking. A C&R would increase the usage of those "ends", which is good. Most everyone at Liedy is fly fishing already and throwing everything back, so no change there. Admittedly there are some bait fisherman that use that area and they will be displaced, which is not good for them. I do expect the new area to be open to spin fishing.

Overall a new designation probably impacts relatively few fisherman but will improve the overall quality of that stretch by getting more fish and better expectations that more remote areas will hold fish. I really think this is a good thing. Liedy is already the most heavily fished section of the stream.

 

[bigjohn58]

That area of stream is 99% reliant on stocking. Fish rarely hold over. Go there in August and Septemer and you can find every fish at the bottom of where that small stream dumps into the top of the Leidy bridge hole, Beaver Dam Run, and Walters Run. Why? Because the water gets way way way too warm almost every summer for the trout to survive. IF this area turns to catch and release it will no longer be stocked and one warm summer and all you will have left are a few smallies, suckers, and chubs. This is one of the areas that IF people want to keep trout they should go to especially later in the year (June and later). After they have been in the streem a while their meat gets rid of the mushy white hatchery flavor and becomes more wild. Harvesting the trout at this time of year just gives the remaining trout a greater chance of possibly surviving also.

Whoever is in favor of this C&R section has never seen how Kettle gets in July, August, and September or they do not understand what it takes for a trout to survive.

 

[salmonoid]

The PFBC is on record stating that not just biological/environmental items are the only considerations when it comes to regulations. Social pressures factor in too. So you may end up with C&R regulations on a stretch where thermal regimes don't support year-round fish residency.

Reference: the C&R regulations on Pine Creek around Slate Run.

 

[bigjohn58]

Yeah that is true with Pine Creek...At least Slate Run though is a lot larger feeder stream with a lot more cold water dumping in then any of the streams dumping into that portion of Kettle.

 

[tomitrout]

IF this area turns to catch and release it will no longer be stocked...

Why do you say this? There are plenty of C&R waters that continue to be stocked under the special regs.

 

[bigjohn58]

If the water is C&R then why would it need to be stocked? Oh wait they want you to keep releasing stocked trout that are just going to die because they can't survive in the stream as it is. I guess thats what happens when we pretend streams are trout streams when they really aren't. I'm all for C&R BUT there are times when keeping a few especially IF they are just going to die does not bother me one bit. I really hate our trout stocking program!

 

[tomitrout]

I'll let somebody else answer your question and get into the back n forth which you may or may not be looking for.

Fact is, there are plenty of C&R regulated waters that are stocked. Just pointing that out since your original statement would lead one to believe that you weren't aware of this.

 

[Prospector]

Most every C&R I have fished is stocked
Kettle, Pine, Young Woman's, Cross Fork, Marvin, Driftwood branch of Sinnemahoning, North Fork of Redbank, Slippery Rock, Caldwell,...etc

I imagine if this goes through on lower Kettle there will be some time allocated to determine exactly which designation it will get. I'm sure Delayed Harvest will be discussed.

 

[Dave_W]

Here in Adams Co we have a nice special reg FFO section that is catch and release. . .even though it gets too warm for trout to survive the summer. This section used to be Delayed Harvest and I would have preferred that it stay that way. Nevertheless, changing regs and local angler insistence on fly fishing rules resulted in this stream going to C&R.

Not sure if this is entirely germane to the situation on Kettle Cr, but it does reveal that social pressure can get C&R regs on a stocked stream that gets too warm for trout.

 

[bigjohn58]

Yeah I guess I knew they did it on Young Womans and Pine Creek. I just don't understand it though. You would think they would want them to be harvested eventually instead of just dying on warmer water streams that do not support wild trout. I don't try to understand our fish commission and they just disappoint me more and more each and every year.

 

[huntfish]

John I see what you're saying, seems like sort of a waste. It would make sense to implement C&R until a certain date so people can fish a given stream longer than a few weeks, then sometime in the summer when the stream average temp gets too warm for the fish change it to normal regs. Is there anything like this anywhere in the state? Just a thought.

 

[TYoung]

It's called delayed harvest.