Clarks Creek, Dauphin County, 3/23/17

scottrum

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Managed to get in a few hours of fishing on Clarks last evening. Was able to land three stock brookies on a streamer but man we still need more rain. There is just no flow in the C&R section especially around all the log jams. Hopefully over next few weeks we get hit hard.

Tight Lines
 
That section is all but trashed. Log jams and eroded banks from the floods of 07. 11 & 13. Many pools have little to no flow and are filled with sand and silt. Mere shadow of what it once was. Can we get some kind of project going on that section? I'll lend a chainsaw and my back.
 
krayfish2 wrote:
That section is all but trashed. Log jams and eroded banks from the floods of 07. 11 & 13. Many pools have little to no flow and are filled with sand and silt. Mere shadow of what it once was. Can we get some kind of project going on that section? I'll lend a chainsaw and my back.

I agree.

While I like woody debris in streams, the situation on Clarks has been an example of storm damage that really has had negative impact IMO. I wonder how Doc Fritchy TU feels about the matter? They're a good group. I wonder if we could help with drumming up some spare hands to help out. An ATV with a pull chain would really be helpful as I'm not sure that heavy equipment can access much of that section. Heck, a good ole fashioned mule would work well.
 
I would help as much as I can. I have a chain saw. Decades ago it was a really good stream to fish, and it had a good Hendrickson hatch. Couldn't figure out why no one stepped up to do stream improvement.
 
I believe I read that part of the issue was the Hemlock Adelgid killing all the hemlocks, which were holding the banks in place.

Groups have limited resources, and can't do every project possible. There's always a certain amount of irony when someone asks why no one else stepped up.

This is akin to people saying that CVTU stood by while some of the smaller limestone creeks disappeared from blasting, quarry operations, and development. CVTU is an active chapter regarding stream stabilization/improvement, but trying to stop development and industry ie money, is nearly impossible without an equal amount of financial backing to combat it.
 
Hurricane Irene in 2011? really changed Clarks. The logjams were so severe and numerous, it changed the course of the stream in many areas.

 
The Woody debris advocates are going to frown on this thread. I've said before the stream in the ffo stretch has been ruined by log jams. If someone damned the stream up intentionally like that we'd all be crying for their arrest. Maybe an arrangement could be made with the Gap to drop a few howitzer rounds into those log jams. Lol. Used to be a really nice stream. One trip last year for me and I won't be back soon.
 
Agree on this. The stream is in drastically different shape than what it was just 5 years ago. The last few times I've gone I haven't seen many fish and there is so much silt build up.

I'd love to help in some restoration as well. Any Doc Fritchey members have input?



 
I'd love to help. It's in my backyard. There was a thread on this after the 2011 flood. It actually flooded the creek 3 different times that year. All three times the valley was shut down. I do believe 1 was killed. I remember mentioning that this was an issue then. It did have some phenomenal hatches.



The float stocking of the creek has gone by the wayside as well. This was the one thing that held clarks apart from the other streams. Helped spread pressure on the creek. They should consider stocking the fish back in the lower parts of clarks. I grew up down there and the bugs were great.
 
Well first thing, any project would need to be coordinated with the Game Commission as they own most of the land for Clark Creek. It would great if at least a path was cut through the log jams to facilitate float stocking.
 
Maybe a path cut through the log jams would be a great start to bringing it back. Some folks with some pull need to get things moving. Sounds like some vollies would be willing to kick in and help with some grunt work. I think it would be a very well worthwhile project.
 
There was just a post about this on the Doc Fritchey Facebook page. It had the comments about letting nature take is course and the log jams provide cover. These were just comment of the page not DFTU stance on the subject. I believe it should be discussed at the next meeting. I know funds are limited and it would have to be coordinated with the Game commission because they own the land. Imagine the difficulties getting coordination from a state agency.

I agree it is not the same section it was in the past. On other streams you just move and fish better water but in this case if you want to fish FFO catch and release you are limited to this section.
So maybe stream improvement to this section would make sense. I believe increased flows from the dam would help in the downstream section.
 
Should streams be managed for the angler or the fish? I haven't fished Clarks in years, so I don't know how "bad" these logjams really are. I am sure they make it more difficult to fish or stock. But, are they adversely affecting the fish population? Or no one knows because it's so hard to fish now, right? ;-)

Using a metric of "the stream isn't what it was ten years ago" probably is not using the right measuring stick. Ten years ago, the PFBC stocked more fish. And fluvial systems change. If nothing is done, ten years from now, Clarks may be much better than it was twenty years prior. Or it may be much worse, but the logjams might have nothing to do with that. My last impressions of Clarks in the FFO area was sand, sand, sand and that followed logging adjacent to and above the reservoir.

I've seen some real brain-dead treatment of logs in streams, I assume under the guise of "management". In several streams I've fished, some really nice logjams developed and created some really nice habitat. Both streams fished well in those areas. Then, someone with a chainsaw came along and cut up the log. The jam dispersed. So did the fish.

On Kinzua Creek, years ago we enjoyed some phenomenal fishing in logjams. The logjams were brookie magnets and were located well above or below stocking points. A single cast or two that most anglers might allocate to this habitat might not reveal much. But they held dozens of fish and usually a breeder or two. Rather than curse them, we fished them and enjoyed them. While they seemed pretty sturdy (big four-foot diameter trees anchoring them), nature took them away and now there is just mostly open, unproductive water where they were previously located.
 
Salmonoid has made some very valid points. The log jams won't last forever. Maybe they are very beneficial to the fish populations and just are deemed as being really inconvenient for the angler. The Hemlock Wooly Adelgid has had as big of an impact as anything and is the main reason for many of the dead hemlock log jams on many fisheries around the State. For us anglers its sad to see the shade that these dense stands of hemlocks provided disappear but in many cases Mother Nature is healing those areas. They may look drastically different and are certainly more challenging for us as anglers to fish but nature does have an amazing way of taking care of itself. Good topic!
 

Let nature take its course or make stream improvements?....It's really a judgement call.

When things are in their natural state, they shouldn't be messed with...

When things are messed up by man, perhaps they should be fixed by man...


A few observations about Clarks:

-The Hemlock Wooly Adelgid was brought here from Asia.

-The stream is dam controlled and the flow is not determined by nature.

-Logging upstream has effected the amount of siltation in the stream.
 
Well I don't think the log jams shoul be removed, just a path cut to assist in angler movement and to help the float stocking. If the stream is going to be stocked, spreading out the fish helps disburse the anglers using the stream. This year the fly section is supposed to get 1900 fish between March and May.
 
Trout Unlimited's mission is to conserve, protect and restore cold water resources. Seems to mean managing/protecting streams for the fish, not to make fishing easier.
 
There is a plan to do a white pine planting along the banks of Clarks Creek on April 30th. If anyone is interested in assisting with the planting please let me know either by PM or give me a call at 717.991.3882
 
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