Leader formulas, how to design my own.

[Bluelinebrookie]

Hey all, I am looking for some help hand tying my own leaders. I will be blue lining a 6’6” for natives. I assume I’ll fish up dry and back down with a nymph. This will require brush friendly techniques like roll and bow-arrow casts. I am looking for a recipe for a leader to fish on the way up-stream and then I could tie on another leader to work my way back down with a nymph.

I will need a short leader, I am thinking of sticking with rod length for this so 6.5 to 7 feet.

I have found some recipes on that website with all the recipes. Problem is that I am having a bit of trouble converting the X system to anything that I can find available online. I was going to go with a 60/20/20 with the butt section in Chamelion and the remainder in Ultragreen.

Could someone provide me with what I would need to get started or their own recipe. Something I can easily order from Amazon.

I am also having trouble finding the why behind the recipes that I see, in other words I am comfortable with the 60/20/20 formula, but I find it hard to figure out how guys are calculating the lengths within that formula. In other words should my 60% butt section be made up of 2 or 3 sections, then how many sections for my mid 20% and lastly how many sections for that last 20%. Is there something to go off of, in other words, never step down more than 2 line sizes between sections or something?

Any help appreciated, thank you!

 

[turkey]

It's been awhile since I've tinkered with this but I have found Leadercalc useful.

LeaderCalc

Simply the Best Place to go for Online Fly Fishing and Fly Tying

globalflyfisher.com

LeaderCalc Download

Find all the LeaderCalc files here

globalflyfisher.com

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

It's been awhile since I've tinkered with this but I have found Leadercalc useful.

LeaderCalc

Simply the Best Place to go for Online Fly Fishing and Fly Tying

globalflyfisher.com

LeaderCalc Download

Find all the LeaderCalc files here

globalflyfisher.com

Thanks so much! The problem that I am having there is that I am finding it nearly impossible to convert the “thousandths” into anything meaningful that I can purchase online. Iv’e looked at x conversion charts etcetera but I am still having a hard time converting any of it into either “lb test” or X numbers that I can purchase.

 

[dc410]

I honestly think you’re overthinking it for blue lining brookies. If you’re fishing a 6’ 6” rod trying to design a 3 part (butt, mid, tippet) leader with multiple size material per section, you’re going to drive yourself into the nut bin.

4’ furled leader, 3’ of your desired tippet material (based on fishing dries - 6X, wets - 5X, nymphs - 4X, or streamers - 3X) - done!!

Or if you want to really keep it simple just use 4X or 5X tippet for everything, because you really don’t need 3X tippet to land a blue line native brookie on a streamer! You’ll be spending a lot more time fishing and catching fish than screwing around with your leader. Tight lines!!

 

[falcon]

You can use the "Rule of 11".
Subtract the X number from 11 the result is the diameter in thousanths.
So 4x tippet is .007 (11 - 4)

Google Orvis News Pro Tips: A Simple Approach to Leaders

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

You can use the "Rule of 11".
Subtract the X number from 11 the result is the diameter in thousanths.
So 4x tippet is .007 (11 - 4)

Google Orvis News Pro Tips: A Simple Approach to Leaders

Never heard that one, it’s fantastic. Thanks!

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

I honestly think you’re overthinking it for blue lining brookies. If you’re fishing a 6’ 6” rod trying to design a 3 part (butt, mid, tippet) leader with multiple size material per section, you’re going to drive yourself into the nut bin.

4’ furled leader, 3’ of your desired tippet material (based on fishing dries - 6X, wets - 5X, nymphs - 4X, or streamers - 3X) - done!!

Or if you want to really keep it simple just use 4X or 5X tippet for everything, because you really don’t need 3X tippet to land a blue line native brookie on a streamer! You’ll be spending a lot more time fishing and catching fish than screwing around with your leader. Tight lines!!

I already feel nuts just thinking about it honestly. You might be on to something.

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear Bluelinebrookie,

I am totally onboard with DC410's suggestion of a short, furled leader and tippet.

You probably won't even need tippet less than 4X either. The best small stream fisherman I ever fished with used nothing but straight yellow 6# test Stren on an 8'6" Fenwick fiberglass 7WT rod with a level 7WT line.

The dude could slay fish, and every cast went exactly where he wanted it to go!

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[turkey]

I'll second the furled leader suggestion. They really simplify the process and turn over so smoothly.

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

Dear Bluelinebrookie,

I am totally onboard with DC410's suggestion of a short, furled leader and tippet.

You probably won't even need tippet less than 4X either. The best small stream fisherman I ever fished with used nothing but straight yellow 6# test Stren on an 8'6" Fenwick fiberglass 7WT rod with a level 7WT line.

The dude could slay fish, and every cast went exactly where he wanted it to go!

Regards,

Tim Murphy

I cant imagine a little Brookie would even bend the tip of a 7wt rod!

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

I'll second the furled leader suggestion. They really simplify the process and turn over so smoothly.

I fish one on the bigger waters and I do like the way it turns over. I worry about the length. Mine might be a 9 or 10 foot plus tippet which would be too big for what I need to do I believe.

 

[TimMurphy]

I cant imagine a little Brookie would even bend the tip of a 7wt rod!

Dear Bluelinebrookie,

Not everyone who fishes for brook trout fishes for gemmies. I did say he could slay fish, didn't I? And it was a fiberglass rod so a stiff wind would bend it. There was a time when 5 or 6 weight rods were the norm, even in graphite, for trout fishing.

Buy a 4-foot furled leader and add 30" of tippet. Honestly, that's all you need.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[dc410]

4’ furled leader

 

[Bamboozle]

Bluelinebrookie:

A couple of things...

Back in the day before furled leaders & LeaderCalc, I took existing leader formulas I found in books and proportionally reduced the section lengths to create shorter leaders. In other words knock of X number of inches off each section.

I also used to fish nothing but a couple of feet of 1X or .012" knotted to some 4X .007 as a tippet. I did this for a LONG time when I wanted something really short.

I may be in the minority but when fishing really small streams, a 7' - 7-1/2' leader is too long for me for a lot a reasons, most related to how much fly line is out past the tip top helping to load the rod. A shorter leader accomplishes this without trying to get 30 feet of line in the air or needing to overload a rod with a heavier line.

That being said, many, many years ago I had the guy who made my furled leaders twist me up 3' foot THREAD furled leaders. With the 3' length, it was easy to keep my leader under 6' which is my preference. I also use silk blend woven leaders I get from Italy that are 1 meter long.

Finally, a furled leader made of mono or fluorocarbon can twist like crazy when snagged and suddenly freed. As snags are much more likely on small tight creeks, IF you go the furled route stick with thread furled leaders.

Good luck finding what works for YOU!!

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

Bluelinebrookie:

A couple of things...

Back in the day before furled leaders & LeaderCalc, I took existing leader formulas I found in books and proportionally reduced the section lengths to create shorter leaders. In other words knock of X number of inches off each section.

I also used to fish nothing but a couple of feet of 1X or .012" knotted to some 4X .007 as a tippet. I did this for a LONG time when I wanted something really short.

I may be in the minority but when fishing really small streams, a 7' - 7-1/2' leader is too long for me for a lot a reasons, most related to how much fly line is out past the tip top helping to load the rod. A shorter leader accomplishes this without trying to get 30 feet of line in the air or needing to overload a rod with a heavier line.

That being said, many, many years ago I had the guy who made my furled leaders twist me up 3' foot THREAD furled leaders. With the 3' length, it was easy to keep my leader under 6' which is my preference. I also use silk blend woven leaders I get from Italy that are 1 meter long.

Finally, a furled leader made of mono or fluorocarbon can twist like crazy when snagged and suddenly freed. As snags are much more likely on small tight creeks, IF you go the furled route stick with thread furled leaders.

Good luck finding what works for YOU!!

You know I was trying to figure out how to shorten some of the leader builds I saw online and in the Orvis book and couldn’t quite figure it out. You are correct though, I guess instead of inches it would have to be a percentage to keep things balanced though correct?

If I want to get a 10’ leader to 6’ lets say, then I would need to knock off 40% and if it were hypothetically a 4 section build I would knock 10% off each section? I don’t know if I am even thinking about that accurately?

 

[Bamboozle]

You know I was trying to figure out how to shorten some of the leader builds I saw online and in the Orvis book and couldn’t quite figure it out. You are correct though, I guess instead of inches it would have to be a percentage to keep things balanced though correct?

If I want to get a 10’ leader to 6’ lets say, then I would need to knock off 40% and if it were hypothetically a 4 section build I would knock 10% off each section? I don’t know if I am even thinking about that accurately?

I didn't get that scientific, I just lopped off an inch or two off each section or halved leader sections to get to my target knowing I could always tweak the butt or tippet if I was hung up on a particular length.

Another thing, when you are casting a short leader (6 foot or under) making casts slightly longer, you can turn over just about ANY leader design because the energy from the fly line is quickly transmitted to the tippet & fly versus having to travel 10+ feet down a leader...

That's why I got away with just using a few feet of leader material at the end of my fly line for so long before I went to the trouble of shrinking leaders. The idea came to me many moons ago fishing a really small Class A with a 6'6" 4wt rod. The shortest leader I had that day was 7'6" and my casts were really short so there was barely any fly line in play...

So I took some 2X (.009), added a Perfection loop in one end so I could attach it to the loop on the end of my fly line, added a tippet to the 2X and I had about a 5'5" leader. With that "leader" I had a couple of feet of fly line working for me, the flies were landing where I wanted and I was catching fish.

I guess in 2024 you could just make up a mini tight-line, Euro style leader of 3-4 feet of 20lb Maxima and a tippet ring and do the same thing however on that day, I didn't have 20lb with me and tippet rings didn't exist...

If you try this tight-line idea, take it from a part-time Tenkara angler, fluorocarbon is denser and casts better by itself than mono. There are also more than a few florescent or hi-viz options in fluoro if you want a leader butt you can see. If you are concerned about it sinking there is always paste floatants.

Another thing that helps a lot are fly lines with short front tapers. The last thing you want when the entire day is casting short besides a long leader is a fly line with "long delicate" front taper. That long front taper means more fly line needs to be in play to get to the belly to load the rod unless you use a heavier line.

Obviously YMMV but when I fish a small wild stream with one of the short sweet 3wt rods that I bought SPECIFICALLY for the situation, I don't want to use a big hackin' reel with a 5wt line on it to make the rod work...

Good luck!!

 

[6xAdams(Jones)]

We generally build our leaders from a recipe on a very old and yellowed index card - but we always consider it a guide and not an absolutely mandated method. The interwebs are rife with this-or-that instruction which serve as a pretty good guide. "Rules" of 60/20/20% and stiffer at the butt and limper at the tip seem to work just fine in most cases.
Generally, the smaller the stream, the shorter the leader - especially with a shorter rod. A 9' leader on a 7' rod annoyingly puts the nail knot into and out of the upper guides every time you land a fish, and casting the same rig on a narrow creek puts no more than a few yards of line out of the rod at best (also annoying as lower accuracy can fling the fly off-the-mark and into surrounding vegetation).
9' leaders for 8'-9' rods and 7.5' leaders for <8' rods are good rule to follow (regardless of line weight). Tippet size is adjusted based on fly size.

 

[Bluelinebrookie]

We generally build our leaders from a recipe on a very old and yellowed index card - but we always consider it a guide and not an absolutely mandated method. The interwebs are rife with this-or-that instruction which serve as a pretty good guide. "Rules" of 60/20/20% and stiffer at the butt and limper at the tip seem to work just fine in most cases.
Generally, the smaller the stream, the shorter the leader - especially with a shorter rod. A 9' leader on a 7' rod annoyingly puts the nail knot into and out of the upper guides every time you land a fish, and casting the same rig on a narrow creek puts no more than a few yards of line out of the rod at best (also annoying as lower accuracy can fling the fly off-the-mark and into surrounding vegetation).
9' leaders for 8'-9' rods and 7.5' leaders for <8' rods are good rule to follow (regardless of line weight). Tippet size is adjusted based on fly size.

That’s true about that nail knot hanging, very irritating indeed!

 

[poopdeck]

Get yourself some mono fishing line, if you don’t already have some, and go test leaders in the situations you want them for and at the lengths you’re looking for. In a matter of an hour or two in your back yard you will have the perfect leader. A single piece butt and a single piece mid section tied to a tippet ring is all your going to need for what you want to do. In fact it will work for more then you want it to do. The age of tying together a dozen 6” pieces of some magical leader material has about run its course for me. Perhaps it’s advances in material or leaders, who knows, but anymore I simply buy a 7’ 3X leader and tie a tippet ring on it that I then add tippet as needed for what I’m fishing. I can fish nymphs, drys, streamers, whatever for the entire season with one or two leaders simply by the addition of a tippet ring and a simpler philosophy. It was a great eye opening tip somebody somewhat recently shared with me. Game changer when you add in old eyes and a cynical mind.

I’m sure you could come up with a 4’ butt and mid section that you can simply tie a tippet ring to and then add a couple feet of tippet to round out a super versatile leader. Embrace the tippet ring and keep it simple.

 

[mgmunson]

Moonlit Fly Fishing has a series of furled leaders. Their "Brookie" leader comes in at 3ft and has been my go-to for my 7.5' 3wt. Now granted, I'm primarily a tenkara angler and use only furled line on my tenkara rods, so the action was familiar and works well for me.