Steelhead flies

[RLeeP]

My gut feel is that fly Tom offered would be a superior fish catcher.

That other thing looks like something Fisher-Price turned out of a mold, although I did not spend a whole lot of time looking at it.

All the same, it (IMO) tends to be somewhat axiomatic in fly tying that attempting too much realism in fly design very often ends up causing a more unnatural look in the water.

There are, just for one example, a couple hundred virtually useless crayfish patterns that attest to this...


JMHO..

 

[tomgamber]

Millertime wrote:
I just tought it was pretty cool that's all. I thought it may add some action to the tail. maybe if I tie some marabou on the back of a standard streamer like that almost like a wooly bugger.

Thanks for the opinion though.

funny you should mention the bugger. WE once got into a bunch of croaker and I stuck a bugger on to see if they'd take those too...only wanted the damn Clouser. Shame too. I had a lot more buggers in my box. I did get some pompano to hit a bugger though.

 

[Millertime]

HAHA. Alright guys thanks for the advice.

All of that being said.

My go to is my cream sucker spawn usually tied with orange thread.

Also Tom, Nice photoshop on that second picture as well.
Awesome. HAHA.

 

[jayL]

Ryan,

What size princes do you find work best?

 

[ryguyfi]

jayL wrote:
Ryan,

What size princes do you find work best?

I have found that sz 14's are pretty good. I tie 12's and 16's, but the 14's seem to be best. I put a bead head on and about 10 wraps of lead, gotta get em down. When they're in there for a while (November, December) I seem to catch just as many on princes than on eggs, sometimes even more. It takes me a while to tie them, but they catch a decent amount of fish for me every year so it's worth it.

 

[jayL]

Thanks.

I'll have to hit the vise to tie some soon.

Years ago, I read an article in fly fisherman about "go2nymphs". The basic idea is to replace the white biots with antron or poly.

I'll let you know how it works on steel.

 

[ryguyfi]

jayL wrote:
Thanks.

I'll have to hit the vise to tie some soon.

Years ago, I read an article in fly fisherman about "go2nymphs". The basic idea is to replace the white biots with antron or poly.

I'll let you know how it works on steel.

so pretty much a zug bug with a black biot tail lol.


I too have to hit the vice again. Tied up about 40 eggs a few weekends ago. The princes are time consuming so I usually set up a TV tray and watch a movie I've already seen and crank some out.

I got my eggs to about 13-15 an hour. When I started tying a GRHE took me 45 min lol.

 

[dano]

In Erie, you'll see far more days with low/clear water than prime conditions.
If you like fishing streamers, make sure you tie some unweighted patterns.
White is a good choice for sight fishing. Shenks White Minnow and white mudlers do well once they absorb enough water to sink and hold in mid column.
In prime flows, it's hard to beat a clouser.

 

[Millertime]

I agree I Princes take me forever to tie. I almost want to just buy them. HAHA.

I tried a bunch of really nice clousers this weekend like were suggested above. I used white buck tail some gray bucktail and a greenish iridescent orvis flashabou. Which give a real nice flash of the emerald shinner greenish silver.

Pretty proud of them hoping to catch some fish in a month or 2.

 

[tomgamber]

how much longer can it take to put a bead on a zug bug and make due? I'd try it before you write it off.

 

[ryguyfi]

tomgamber wrote:
how much longer can it take to put a bead on a zug bug and make due? I'd try it before you write it off.

I think he meant the pattern in general. bead, lead, biot tail, tinsel, peacock, hackle, biot wing, finish..... takes me about 15-20 minutes a fly depending on whether I'm sitting down intently tying, or watching tv and tying. Just more in depth than a HE.

 

[jayL]

ryguyfi wrote:

tomgamber wrote:
how much longer can it take to put a bead on a zug bug and make due? I'd try it before you write it off.

I think he meant the pattern in general. bead, lead, biot tail, tinsel, peacock, hackle, biot wing, finish..... takes me about 15-20 minutes a fly depending on whether I'm sitting down intently tying, or watching tv and tying. Just more in depth than a HE.

3 words:

Peacock. ice. dub.

 

[tomgamber]

ryguyfi wrote:

tomgamber wrote:
how much longer can it take to put a bead on a zug bug and make due? I'd try it before you write it off.

I think he meant the pattern in general. bead, lead, biot tail, tinsel, peacock, hackle, biot wing, finish..... takes me about 15-20 minutes a fly depending on whether I'm sitting down intently tying, or watching tv and tying. Just more in depth than a HE.

Takes me almost that long to tie a proper prince too. But it takes me half that to tie a zug bug with a bead head. Bead, herl, wire, throat, wing case, done. They are really close and I'm a shortcut kind of person.

 

[ryguyfi]

Reorganized my steelhead flies into one box and here's the picture. 85 flies and counting. I'd like to have the box filled by the first run, but we'll see how that goes. Tied up a few "bombers" last year but never tied them on, gonna try to get one on top this year.

 

[Millertime]

Nice Spread Ryan.

Question for everyone. . .It has kind of been talked about earlier in this thread.

How important are the legs (hackle) on the bead head prince nymph as well as the ribbing? Tom, are those good short cuts to take or not??

I tied one real quick yesterday after work and left the hackle and rib off. It looked nice clean and simple. I am wondering if anyone has tried fishing something like that before.

It only takes another 3 to 4 minutes to put the rib and hackle on but when tying 10-15 prince that saves atleast a half hour to 40 minutes.

 

[tomgamber]

Millertime wrote:
Nice Spread Ryan.

Question for everyone. . .It has kind of been talked about earlier in this thread.

How important are the legs (hackle) on the bead head prince nymph as well as the ribbing? Tom, are those good short cuts to take or not??

I tied one real quick yesterday after work and left the hackle and rib off. It looked nice clean and simple. I am wondering if anyone has tried fishing something like that before.

It only takes another 3 to 4 minutes to put the rib and hackle on but when tying 10-15 prince that saves atleast a half hour to 40 minutes.

Ribbing is a durability thing as far as I'm concerned. I now it represents segmentation but so do wraps of peacock herl. I still tie in the hackle. Its like 2 wraps. I trim all but the bottom off. "wire "refers to the ribbing and "throat" refers to the hackle but they both are still there. Its the tail and the biots where you save time. Its just a simpler fly. Depends where your priorities lie.

 

[jayL]

tomgamber wrote:
Its the tail and the biots where you save time. Its just a simpler fly. Depends where your priorities lie.

Exactly. Anything that involves positioning individual pieces of material on the hook like that adds time and complexity. The tails and biots on a prince are a PITA compared to the rest of the fly. A zug bug has all of the same important features (triggers to the fish), minus the complexity. Prince nymphs have just been marketed better.

When tying attractors, substitutions can be made pretty easily.

 

[ryguyfi]

I'll have to agree with what's been said so far. However, if it's not broke, don't fix it. I've tied my princes the same way since I started tying and have always caught fish on them. It's my go to nymph and I don't ever intend on messing with my pattern. The only thing I ever change is my hackle. Mostly brown, but sometimes tan or grizzly. I like a longer hackle to make it a bit like a wet fly too. There were 2 kids from a local college fishing next to me in Erie last year and weren't getting a hit, and I was killing them. I handed them 2 princes each and just watched them have a ball. Nothing's better than that!



Anyone have a preference on egg sizes? Most of mine pictured are on a sz 10 scud hook. I seem to have the most success with that size on steelies. I occasionally go to a sz 14, but usually just change color, not size.

Does size really matter?

 

[shakey]

it might be interesting to note that i have a different catch rate with zug bugs and prince nymphs.

in my household i tye the zugbugs and my girlfriend tyes the princes.

i have tried the "go to" wings instead of biot on prince nymphs with no success on trout(never tried them on steelhead)when regular prince nymphs did fine.

i also think the ribbing adds a lot of flash,not just segmentation or protection to the herl.

zug bugs and princes sure are two nymphs that are hard to beat.

 

[Millertime]

Very nice guys thanks for the input.

I think I will probably keep tying the traditional princes for now
I just need to buckle down and make them.

I have a bunch of tail and wing biots and I am finally after several months getting better at attaching them properly.



That is also what I have been tying my eggs on. (sz10 scud)
I havent had much success on a single egg personally.
I would assume if stream conditions change. Much like normal trout fishing step up a size so the fish would see it a bit better.

I look forward to this year and trying some new things I havent before.