Yellow Breeches section closed for stream work

wgmiller said:
A lot of times the rock structures (if unrestrained by wire caging, etc.) just fall victim to high water events anyway. There's a few of them on the Donegal in such condition.

Conversely, as far as in-stream structures that have improved habitat, one place I can think of is Big Spring Creek in Cumberland County. As many know, this is a classic spring creek with little natural holding structure other than weed beds and undercuts. The vane deflectors that were installed have created some habit where none previously existed.

Here's an interesting document on stream habitat improvements from the PFBC: https://www.fishandboat.com/Resource/Documents/habitat_improve_trout.pdf
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I have not seen the Big Spring Improvements yet, but I like them even less on a meadow spring creek. There is no place for these type of structures in this type of creek. A little bank stabilization is ok, but plunge pools and scour areas are not the best habitat IMO. Weeds and undercut banks are much better on these streams.

I have seen rock vanes in place on a spring creek and all they achieved was to create a dam affect with a load of silt built up behind the rock. It did create a scoured area below the vane, but the fish habitat was not improved at all. I know 2 examples of this. One has been in place for decades and another maybe 5 or 6 years. The increased flow rate below these vanes has washed away any in-stream vegetation and it takes years to recover if it does at all.

Improve water quality and the rest will take care of itself.
 

Bamboozle said:
I also feel the gabion defectors installed on the Little Lehigh former Heritage Stretch improved & stabilized things a lot as did some of the more recent work on Run where there was a lot of bank erosion years ago opposite the "wall."
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The Heritage section work on the Little Lehigh created a good environment for the stocked fish there, but the wild fish have been in serious decline for years. It is getting really bad. These improvements have not helped especially the ones up and downstream.

What did help was letting the bank vegetation grow in and allow fallen trees to remain in the stream, but the parks department mowed the vegetation and removed the fallen trees. There was a time when the wild trout population was really good and it coincided with the increased stream riparian buffer. When that was mowed down it suffered. This was not that long ago either. Flooding has taken its toll on any vegetation that tries to get a foothold in there. I have seen it degrade there and even the upper parts which used to hold plenty. The bug life suffers too.
 
For those interested:

Due to the predicted weather for this afternoon into tomorrow, as well as site conditions at the project, we are going to cancel this Friday’s site showing that was scheduled for February 25. We are going to reschedule March 11’s site showing to Thursday, March 17, 2022 due to staffing availability. This will be the last site showing for this spring and we will have additional site showings starting in July as we start the second part of the project.



Next site showing: MARCH 17, 2022 at 1:00 PM. We will meet at the parking lot with the iron furnace at the outlet of Children’s Lake in Boiling Springs. If able, please send me a RSVP so I can send out updates if anything changes again.


Really quick project update:
All structures upstream of the historic dam at Allenberry have been completed. Construction crew is in the process of restoring/dressing up the disturbed areas, planting the disturbed areas with temporary grass seed and native wildflower mixes & mulching. Additional work this spring will include invasive species removal and replanting of native wildflower mixes, shrubs and trees.
 
joebamboo said:
For those interested:

Due to the predicted weather for this afternoon into tomorrow, as well as site conditions at the project, we are going to cancel this Friday’s site showing that was scheduled for February 25. We are going to reschedule March 11’s site showing to Thursday, March 17, 2022 due to staffing availability. This will be the last site showing for this spring and we will have additional site showings starting in July as we start the second part of the project.



Next site showing: MARCH 17, 2022 at 1:00 PM. We will meet at the parking lot with the iron furnace at the outlet of Children’s Lake in Boiling Springs. If able, please send me a RSVP so I can send out updates if anything changes again.


Really quick project update:
All structures upstream of the historic dam at Allenberry have been completed. Construction crew is in the process of restoring/dressing up the disturbed areas, planting the disturbed areas with temporary grass seed and native wildflower mixes & mulching. Additional work this spring will include invasive species removal and replanting of native wildflower mixes, shrubs and trees.
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Joe - does this mean the C&R section will be open next week?
 
No, supposedly it will not be totally open until March. Currently you can access it on Saturdays and Sundays.
 
Does anyone have a photo of what the dam looks like now, and/or photos of the other work?
 
Troutbert, I do not have pictures handy. The dam is an old lowhead dam that is partially breeched either likely due to deterioration. When I was there in person a summer or 2 ago, fish passage was still possible. The structure caused a large, featureless flat pool that was wider than the stream should be.

I do not know how the project is related to the dam, I believe someone indicated a rock crossvane would be placed there to lower the pool elevation and narrow the stream channel.
 
Just had an opportunity to check out the work at the junction of the Run and the Breeches - to my eyes, it looks fantastic. I've seen the Breeches blow that area out several times over the past 20 years - early spring it was often a muddy mess. They've tightened things up, which will increase the stream flow a little. I'm only slightly disappointed in that, over the past 15 years of taking students there for stream surveys, I'll no longer have the pleasure of watching a student or two fall in the mud:)
 
mattofcarlisle said:
Just had an opportunity to check out the work at the junction of the Run and the Breeches - to my eyes, it looks fantastic. I've seen the Breeches blow that area out several times over the past 20 years - early spring it was often a muddy mess. They've tightened things up, which will increase the stream flow a little. I'm only slightly disappointed in that, over the past 15 years of taking students there for stream surveys, I'll no longer have the pleasure of watching a student or two fall in the mud:)
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Did they leave any fish?? A few 20 inchers would be nice. 😀

I might try to get up there this week.
 
I, along with a score or there of my closest friends, fished and waded the main stem from the Run to the flat water during yesterday’s warm up. So many changes it is hardly recognizable. Spin guys everywhere. One issue is that the banks are overly accessible now. Never had I seen guys fishing from the bank here previously. I stumbled upon a large group just settling in on chairs on a couple of the new vanes with minnow buckets, coolers and baitcasters on forked sticks. I forcefully explained the artificial and C&R regs and pointed out the signs. Despite a language barrier they packed up and left. I understand the opening day economics but year round fishing would reduce the poaching on these areas. Great to get out after the Lancaster show pep rally.
 
Not surprising that anyone and everyone are showing up given that it is so accessible. Hopefully Fish and Game patrol the area more. Personally, I would like to see this convert to a Fly Fish Only C&R. Even before the renovations too many times the Joe Rambo spin fisherman were stomping through pools and runs bombing the place. Nothing like putting all the fish down and then complaining about how bad the fishing is....

I'm hoping to get up there this week (weekday and avoid weekends). Or if it gets a lot of rain then I'll head south to the Rapidan.
 
mikeg126 said:
Not surprising that anyone and everyone are showing up given that it is so accessible. Hopefully Fish and Game patrol the area more. Personally, I would like to see this convert to a Fly Fish Only C&R. Even before the renovations too many times the Joe Rambo spin fisherman were stomping through pools and runs bombing the place. Nothing like putting all the fish down and then complaining about how bad the fishing is....

I'm hoping to get up there this week (weekday and avoid weekends). Or if it gets a lot of rain then I'll head south to the Rapidan.
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The regs section is still closed during the week, as far as I know.
 
STONEMAN said:
I stumbled upon a large group just settling in on chairs on a couple of the new vanes with minnow buckets, coolers and baitcasters on forked sticks. I forcefully explained the artificial and C&R regs and pointed out the signs...
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In regards to folks disregarding the CRALO regulations...

If they were fishing bait they were also most likely harvesting or planning to harvest. If it was me, I would have said nothing and ratted them out by calling South Central Regional Law Enforcement (717-486-7087).

I've ratted out other A-holes there and on the Run and the WCO responded promptly.

IMHO - A citation goes a long way to wise-up folks that definitely know better...
 
The Catch and Release section is now open. It will remain open until July when the "Stream Improvements" start again at the lower end at Allenberry. I still believe this endeavor will not bode well for the Catch and Release section. Sunday is a prime example of what's to come.

The local WCO recently retired. Getting someone to respond now will more than likely be an effort in futility.
 
With all of the illegal fishing in this section now and in the past, this will give Allenberry a prime reason to post their land and go to pay to play.
 
Until the Allenberry is paying for the trout that go into that stretch, I really don't think they will care about folks not following the regulations or will be particularly anxious to start footing the bill if they close it for that reason...

It's also not all their dirt to close.

Just my $ .02.
 
Allenberry owns the property at both Criswell and Mountain road. Should he post it. Even if the other two owners would allow access to their property, one would be trespassing to get there.
 
It's about a 10 yard walk across two parcels to get to NON-Allenberry owned land along the stream and it would only be trespassing if those owners took issue.

About as worthwhile worrying about as Allenberry going pay to play...
 
If Allenberry posts the land, it doesn't matter how many yards you walk, to get to land that isn't posted, you will be trespassing. "But officer, I only broke the law for a little bit" Wonder how that would work. One cannot access the stream from the far side without first crossing Allenberry property. Not that hard to understand,. It is all a moot point at this time. Some are ok with the project some are not.
 
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