2024 Trout Stocking Schedule?

[Mike]

I should scan that old Class A list Del sent me and post it here. It would probably be familiar to you...

I believe I might have had that list in my filing cabinet at the office. Is it the one that also had the alkalinity value for each Class A section?

By the way, Del got me into my first trout on a dry fly…Fishing Creek a couple of miles below Lamar caught on a bivisible that he gave me. I started out fishing with live Japanese beetles, but with no luck he then provided me with the fly. We were on a great stretch of water off the beaten path to which I directed him and where earlier in that month we had sampled 500 wild browns in 500 meters of stream.

 

[Bamboozle]

I believe I might have had that list in my filing cabinet at the office. Is it the one that also had the alkalinity value for each Class A section?

By the way, Del got me into my first trout on a dry fly…Fishing Creek a couple of miles below Lamar caught on a bivisible that he gave me. I started out fishing with live Japanese beetles, but with no luck he then provided me with the fly. We were on a great stretch of water off the beaten path to which I directed him and where earlier in that month we had sampled 500 wild browns in 500 meters of stream.

No alkalinity, no section number or limits, no species, no private/public ownership, no nearest town or USGS Quad info, no county numbering system...

...not even organized by county...

Just an alphabetical list of 99 stream stream names, the county where the stream or mouth is located and the approximate length of the Class A portion.

As a kid who cut his trout teeth on Approved Trout Waters in Delco & Chesco, I was enamored with "Operation Future" when Del wrote, "Wild Trout Management in Pennsylvania," a three part article featured in the 1982 April, May & June issues of PA Angler magazine.

I especially liked Part III with him AS A FLY FISHERMAN saying, "it is amusing seeing fly fishermen wearing tweed hats or canvas hats with little air vents on the side, patches all over their fishing vests with flex lights, surgical tools and assorted paraphernalia dangling on or about them and a mult-trayed fly box strapped to their chest."

I never met Del but he must have seen me on the Letort once because that described ME to a "T" back when the article was written... 😆

A few months later in the April 1983 PA Angler there was another article about Operation Future by Michael J. Bickler of the Commission's Office of Information that appears to be an attempt to quell fears amongst the "non-tweed hat crowd" that Operation Future meant the ultimate end to stocking.

Also in that issue was a section later offered as a separate "booklet" titled "Trout Fishing in Pennsylvania" with crude color coded maps of the trout streams and a listing of "Approved Trout Waters." by region & county.

After the roll-out of Operation Future I used to correspond with Del via snail-mail and I probably called him a few times seeking information so I figure that's how I got that particular Class A list. Because I was young & stupid and didn't have any "inside dope" about places NOT on that list or those maps, I just figured that was it and used those two sources of information to find "wild trout."

I guess that's why in 2024 having more information accessible from a single location appeals to me... 😉

The old Class A list is below:

 

[Mike]

Wow, what a trip down memory lane. I had never seen that specific list and the vast majority of those stream sections were ones that were removed from the trout stocking program due to their Class A status when Operation Future began. Can you believe the guts, politicians be damned, that Ralph Abele and the Commissioners had in those days to remove those streams from the stocking program all at once?

As for me, the list is interesting because I either participated in or led the qualifying surveys in the following cases:
Fishing Ck, Clinton Co.
Hoagland Branch, Sullivan Co.
Laurel Rn, Centre Co.
Lick Rn., Centre Co
Willow Rn., Juniata Co.
And depending upon the section that eventually went Class A, I may have participated in the Pine Ck, Centre Co; Penns Ck; Spruce Ck, Centre Co; Ltl Fishing Ck, Centre Co, and Wallace Rn, Centre Co surveys. I did or participated in surveys on those streams, but I’m not certain if the sections on the list are the sections that I surveyed since no section numbers are included.

 

[Bamboozle]

Wow, what a trip down memory lane...

Mike:

That's pretty cool you were involved!!

Is that you in any of the pictures that were in those 1982 Angler articles about Operation Future? There are at least three or four including the front cover of the June 1982 issue that showed electroshocking crews. One guy in particular always reminded me of my high school agriculture teacher. 😉

The stream that popped out at me on the old list I posted is Sacony Creek in Berks because it is close to my home and I've fished it a few times although not recently. Excluding the old list I posted, I have Class A lists going back to 2006 and I never saw Sacony Creek on any of them.

I also have Summary Booklets going back to the 1960's so I guess I could see when Sacony disappeared and reappeared from the Approved Trout Waters list however, do you have any insight when Sacony came OFF the Class A list?

 

[Mike]

Mike:

That's pretty cool you were involved!!

Is that you in any of the pictures that were in those 1982 Angler articles about Operation Future? There are at least three or four including the front cover of the June 1982 issue that showed electroshocking crews. One guy in particular always reminded me of my high school agriculture teacher. 😉

The stream that popped out at me on the old list I posted is Sacony Creek in Berks because it is close to my home and I've fished it a few times although not recently. Excluding the old list I posted, I have Class A lists going back to 2006 and I never saw Sacony Creek on any of them.

I also have Summary Booklets going back to the 1960's so I guess I could see when Sacony disappeared and reappeared from the Approved Trout Waters list however, do you have any insight when Sacony came OFF the Class A list?

Part of Sacony should be on the Class A list unless it didn’t hold its Class A status throughout the years and was removed before the mantra “once a Class A, always a Class A,” (no comment), became the rule of the land with certain limited exceptions. The section that was removed from the stocking program due to the Class A biomass extended from Park Rd, also known as the Mertztown, Topton, Lions, Blandon Rd upstream to Sally Ann Furnace area and blended with the wild trout stretch above on the hillsideside and top of the ridge. Ltl Sacony also has a wild BT pop. Farther downstream above the marsh in K-town a decent wild BT pop starts again below a large limestone spring, but it fizzles within about a half mile. Then the stream revitalizes itself again below Rt 222 and the K-town STP where you will find stocked trout that have run downstream and a fishable population of wild browns in the occasional fishy looking habitat all of the way down to the vicinity of the adjacent, small SGL. The stream is wide and shallow, so walking from hole to hole about 75 yds apart on avg would be the approach. Likewise, Mill Ck and an unnamed trib to Mill Ck likely contribute some wild BT to Sacony, as may a trib near Bowers that to my knowledge has never been surveyed. There are some “surprises” lurking below K-town.

As for my pic being in those particular Pa Anglers, I couldn’t say. It’s possible, but I don’t recall specifically being in the pics accompanying those very good articles. I was involved in surveying many of Pa’s most famous wild trout streams and those surveys were where staff PR people often showed up with cameras.

 

[Bamboozle]

Mike:

The part of Sacony I fished is from about Bastian Road upstream to Bowers park courtesy of a local farmer who was happy to give me access and keep me company while I fished some near impossible stretches because of dense growth of multiflora rose on both sides of the narrow creek channel.

I seem to recall catching a few wild BT and fallfish and nothing in the Park so I wasn't too enthralled with my results but the day started out with my first ever trip to Letterman's Diner in Kutztown so it wasn't all bad... 😉

I've also fished Mill a few times with similar results but it's been a LONG time...

I'm going to peruse my collection of Summary Booklets starting around 1980 and see if I can deduce anything about Sacony's inclusion and exclusion from the Class A list but it hasn't been on any OTHER Class A List I've seen with the exception of that first list.

Unless I am mistaken the PFBC took down the really old legacy issues of the PA Angler because I couldn't find a PDF of the 1982 issues about Operation Future with the photos of the electroshocking.

If I am correct about that I'll scan the old Angler's I have with the photos and post them later.

 

[Bamboozle]

Mike:

Update:

I was smart enough to download ALL of the legacy issues of the PA Angler several years ago so attached are the images I was talking about:

 

[Mike]

I’ve been finding fingerling wild BT when sampling macroinvertebrates in Mill at the K-town R&G Club. I don’t know anything about the adult wild trout population there and the last time I sampled that spot was in the early 1980’s and at that time I don’t believe we found any wild trout. I sampled Mill via electrofishing in an area close to the mouth back in about 2018 and wherever there was habitat to support adult wild trout, they were there. In general though the habitat was poor and so was the population. Mill’s habitat gets much better along Gun Club Rd.

As for the pics, the first one is a pic of me with the backpack electrofisher. I was somewhere around 26-27 yrs old.

 

[Bamboozle]

With the mustache...?

That's a hoot because you are a dead ringer for my high school agriculture teacher...!!

 

[tomgamber]

As for the pics, the first one is a pic of me with the backpack electrofisher. I was somewhere around 26-27 yrs olold.

That's cool.