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[Fish Sticks]

Pennsylvania Isn't Doing Enough for its Floundering Native Brook Trout - Fly Fisherman

Disjointed habitat improvements won't save Pennsylvania's brook trout. We need watershed-wide management, and we need to stop stocking invasive species.

www.flyfisherman.com

 

[Acristickid]

Hah, you quick. I posted about this in the “native plan” thread. Now I see.

 

[Fish Sticks]

Hah, you quick. I posted about this in the “native plan” thread. Now I see.

Your quick I saw yours like 2 sec after mine lol

 

[Cznymph]

I hope they take a look at it, but I’d hold my breath on anything coming from it. However I’m sure it will ruffle some feathers. I saw on the PFBC Facebook page where a poster was complaining that the PFBC had deleted posts from him that were critical of the agency. I’m not sure if that’s even legal to do, I’m aware of other government pages and elected officials who have been take to court for the same thing.

 

[Fish Sticks]

I hope they take a look at it, but I’d hold my breath on anything coming from it. However I’m sure it will ruffle some feathers. I saw on the PFBC Facebook page where a poster was complaining that the PFBC had deleted posts from him that were critical of the agency. I’m not sure if that’s even legal to do, I’m aware of other government pages and elected officials who have been take to court for the same thing.

Yea I got blocked when I had a facebook for pointing out that PFBC stocks invasive species over our state fish and state amphibian.

 

[flyguyfishing]

This a well written article. Kudos.

I do have a question. First, I do want to be clear - I support the protection of eastern brook trout in PA. I also acknowledge brown trout are listed as invasive by the scientific authorities.

You wrote, “Conservation” aims to maintain biodiversity because ecosystems that have more different species are less susceptible to instability. Invasive species decrease biodiversity and destabilize ecosystems.”

My question, besides harming eastern brook trout populations, how else do brown trout negatively impact the cold water ecosystem? They both eat the same(?) and produce the same waste (?).

One could argue brown trout replacing eastern brook trout would not increase biodiversity (biodiversity would be the same - one species in the trout family). Therefore, the issue of eastern brook trout is not a conservationist issue (per your definition).

Again, the question is, besides harming eastern brook trout, how do brown trout negatively effect the ecosystem?

 

[silverfox]

This a well written article. Kudos.

I do have a question. First, I do want to be clear - I support the protection of eastern brook trout in PA. I also acknowledge brown trout are listed as invasive by the scientific authorities.

You wrote, “Conservation” aims to maintain biodiversity because ecosystems that have more different species are less susceptible to instability. Invasive species decrease biodiversity and destabilize ecosystems.”

My question, besides harming eastern brook trout populations, how else do brown trout negatively impact the cold water ecosystem? They both eat the same(?) and produce the same waste (?).

One could argue brown trout replacing eastern brook trout would not increase biodiversity (biodiversity would be the same - one species in the trout family). Therefore, the issue of eastern brook trout is not a conservationist issue (per your definition).

Again, the question is, besides harming eastern brook trout, how do brown trout negatively effect the ecosystem?

BT are not direct analogs for ST. Different growth rates, aggressiveness, and behaviors, and in at least two papers I've read, are not as easily detected by native prey species as native predator species. Those differences likely mean a trophic cascade is occurring, but likely at a very slow pace or with relatively minimal impacts. In NZ, researchers found that BT ultimately altered ecosystem function down to the algae level and was responsible for the collapse of mayfly species.

 

[Fish Sticks]

This a well written article. Kudos.

I do have a question. First, I do want to be clear - I support the protection of eastern brook trout in PA. I also acknowledge brown trout are listed as invasive by the scientific authorities.

You wrote, “Conservation” aims to maintain biodiversity because ecosystems that have more different species are less susceptible to instability. Invasive species decrease biodiversity and destabilize ecosystems.”

My question, besides harming eastern brook trout populations, how else do brown trout negatively impact the cold water ecosystem? They both eat the same(?) and produce the same waste (?).

One could argue brown trout replacing eastern brook trout would not increase biodiversity (biodiversity would be the same - one species in the trout family). Therefore, the issue of eastern brook trout is not a conservationist issue (per your definition).

Again, the question is, besides harming eastern brook trout, how do brown trout negatively effect the ecosystem?

my understanding is basically what silver fox said. They don’t feed the same as native brook trout, i have seen terrestrial predators such as birds do not feed the same on them, their forage has no specific evolved defense mechanisms against them. For example hellbenders can detect chemical cues a brook trout is around and larval and juvenile hellbenders can hide or defend themselves. Not with browns and rainbows though and the paper said their likely contributing to significant decline in hellbenders. Brown trout have been shown to be a threat to sandy river/guyandotte crayfish and candy darters, both endangered. All around the world when they have replaced a native trout people have considered them analogues, which would be an intuitive thought, but unfortunately incorrect.

 

[flyguyfishing]

Thanks. I found it.

For anyone else…

(PDF) Innate Predator Recognition and the Problem of Introduced Trout

PDF | Innate predator recognition typically only occurs when there is an evolutionary history between predator and prey. Predator introductions thus can... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

 

[Fish Sticks]

Thanks. I found it.

For anyone else…

(PDF) Innate Predator Recognition and the Problem of Introduced Trout

PDF | Innate predator recognition typically only occurs when there is an evolutionary history between predator and prey. Predator introductions thus can... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

Here is one highlighting that browns can have negative effects on small native fish in PA that are not game fish. This is the only pa study I have seen on the topic and piscivorous invasive brown trout presence does not seem to bode well for these small native fish, surprise suprise lol. Some of these small native fish where these concerns exist but largely are not being studied are threatend or endangered at state level. We know browns harm small native fish all over the US and all over the globe. I think as far as more study thats something PFBC isn’t going to do and is not eager to dive in. Easier to stock.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/312175241_Co-varying_impacts_of_land_use_and_non-native_brown_trout_on_fish_communities_in_small_streams