Yough River - Wild Trout?

[dryflyguy]

Dmomeyer:

Do you remember when they had the two small rock dams in the area between the bike trail bridge, and the casselman?

I'm guessing that they were put in to help settle turbidity in the outflow water.
And I actually had some decent fishing in the pools that they made.
Always wondered why they took them out.

 

[sidthemuffinrunner]

I can confidently say that there is a good amount of aquatic insect life below the Casselman. Turn over a rock in the spring down by the islands and you'll find heavy mayfly nymphs populations and a fair amount of shrimp/scuds. +1 for water acidity. To me, this is the most logical reason for a lack of wild trout. Laurel Highland soil, in general, is very acidic. Dump lime into the lake or line the dam/part of the river with limestone. Not sure if that'd work but....

 

[Dmomeyer]

Yes, the polls were nice to fish.

I fished above Ohiopyle yesterday afternoon, rode my bike up the trail 2 miles. No luck, did not see any other fisherman, alot of slate drakes but no rises.

 

[DaveS]

Couple things to add; All due respect to Sid, whom I have fished with a few times, the gage below Confluence shows a pretty decent ph at that portion of the river. Plus I’m not aware of scuds being very tolerant of poor water quality.
I tend to think when temps push up to the high limits, the fish are forced into relatively small thermal refuge areas and the YOY and other small fish don’t fare too well.
Couple that with pretty small tribs with limited spawning habitat and sediment from the Casselman, its a tough time for naturally reproducing trout.

If there is a way to optimize the cool water pool from the lake and minimize the sediment load on the Casselman and maybe LH, then you may see an improvement in trout numbers.

 

[fayettenamese]

For years I have also wondered why we don't see wild fish thriving in Yough. I live on the Yough in Connellsville and I fish it from there up to the middle yough quite often, and have done so for a decade. I know for sure that native brook trout use the river to travel from tributary to tributary. This means that they must then spend at least some amount of time in the river. Although, of the more than thousand trout I've caught in the river, I've never caught a native brookie. I wish I could tell you how I know...haha... but It would reveal some of my heard earned fishing secrets.

 

[greenghost]

Dmomeyer wrote:
In summary, it could be a world class fishery if managed; pump lime in the water and manage the water releases to regulate temperatures.

Yeah, I agree. The temperature between mid-August to October can be an issue. I think overall the water quality is slowly improving. Years ago there used to be fish kills in the Yough caused by pollution from the Caselemen and other tribs. But it's been many years since the last one happened, at least as far as I know. But it only takes one AMD slug incident from the Casselman or another trib to cause a setback.

Unfortunately, the management commitment required to raise the quality of year-round fishing is not realistic right now. The water is managed for the huge rafting draw in Ohiopyle.

I've been fishing the river for 35 years, the insect hatches have DEFINITELY become better than, say, in the late seventies. Regulations have helped keep more fish in the water year-round. As far as natural reproduction? I honestly don't know. You'd think there would be some. But not enough to support a fishery on its own... I'm sure of that.

Between temps, spotty and sectional insect life, suspect water quality, dam releases schedule to support rafting, not fish... the Yough is just one quirky river, like dryflyguy said, a paradox.

 

[slatedrake]

I fish the Yough a lot,and live within walking distance of the tailwater,typically fish it 3 or 4 times a week.
Ive never caught a fish in the middle I thought was wild.
Its funny catching all the brookies they stocked this year,thats a bit different.

 

[inthedrift]

The single biggest detriment to the river that may actually have a hope of being addressed is with flow management. We run out of cold water around August every year, and don't get good temps back until the Casselman cools sometime in October.

It just so happens that the Army Corps is seeking public comments on the Yough Master Plan until August 7. This could be the chance to provide some input, or at least let them know that people care: https://triblive.com/local/regional/u-s-army-corps-seeking-input-on-youghiogheny-river-lake-master-plan/

The purpose of the dam is flood protection, but everyone is well aware of the summer bumps that are provided to support rafting. Some creative management of flows (even from the other flood protection projects in the region) could help to better manage flows, and perhaps improve the fishery.

There's also an issue with PFBC that hasn't gotten a ton of attention. They have largely been hands-off with the river. Look at the survey data, and it will tell you all that you need to know. PFBC surveyed in '89, '94, and 2012. They also did so using sampling gear that had significant limitations (particularly on the coldwater sections) which likely limited the accuracy of the surveys. You don't have to be a stats expert to understand that a limited sample size isn't going to give you representative data, yet they make management decisions based off of those events. For instance, a few years back, they shifted the percentage of rainbow/brown fingerlings from an even split, to one that favors more rainbows, because "rainbows do better in the river". That's straight from Rick Lorson's mouth, and somewhat contrary to what we've seen over the years. Again, this is based off of 3 sampling events that stretched over a 23 year time period where the river has made significant gains in water quality and bug life (whoever posted that there is limited bug life in the river needs to have their vision checked, or maybe fish the river more).

The warmwater portion of the river mostly takes care of itself, but for the life of me, I can't understand why the coldwater portions of the river haven't been given the attention they deserve from a management perspective. It's a unique, big river, that is floatable through predominantly public land. On top of that, it's in close proximity to several major population centers, and keeps cold water when nearly everything else is drying up. You would think this would be a river that they would want to put a spotlight on. Yet, PFBC and DCNR do very little to learn about what is there, manage it appropriately, and facilitate access. It's maddening...

 

[greenghost]

inthedrift wrote:
The single biggest detriment to the river that may actually have a hope of being addressed is with flow management. We run out of cold water around August every year, and don't get good temps back until the Casselman cools sometime in October.

It just so happens that the Army Corps is seeking public comments on the Yough Master Plan until August 7. This could be the chance to provide some input, or at least let them know that people care: https://triblive.com/local/regional/u-s-army-corps-seeking-input-on-youghiogheny-river-lake-master-plan/

Thank you for letting us know about this comment period. I wrote a response that stressed the importance of managing flow for the cold-water fishery. Hopefully others will too!

 

[shthomas]

Nice to see long-time fishers of the middle and lower Yough share their experiences and thoughts. Even with 35 years of regularly fishing the river year-round, I don’t have a lot new to add to what’s already been said. The water quality, bug life, and forage have definitely improved over time, albeit in small increments and with some occasional setbacks. The tribs do not offer great spawning habitat and a couple of the more promising tribs are blocked from passage by culverts not far from where they meet the river. There is not a lot of spawning habitat in the river itself. The Casselman contributes a good bit of silt and sometimes worse.

I personally have not caught a fish in the Yough (other than a few brookies near the mouths of tribs) that I am totally convinced was wild. Thus, it seems to me that the fingerling program will be necessary to sustain trout populations a while longer. It will be fantastic when the day comes that wild trout are a regular part of the Yough fishery.

In my experience, insights on this river can be pretty hard won. The river is sufficiently imposing and enigmatic that it’s tough to be consistently successful, especially if you measure success in the number of nice fish caught on every trip to the river. For this reason, I give the PFBC and others a little bit of a pass. If the solution to establishing a sustainable population of wild trout in the 30 miles downriver from Confluence was obvious and inexpensive, then I think the interested parties would have hit upon and implemented it already. At the margin, slightly more restrictive regs and better management of cold water would likely improve the quality of the fishery.

I don’t think that the actual number of people regularly fishing the Yough from Ramcat to South Connellsville for trout is very large. Thus, the lack of emphasis from the PFBC is perhaps a bit understandable, if short-sighted. While the number of people fishing the river would increase if the quality of the fishery improved and the local economy would benefit, the quality of the fishery that is ultimately obtainable will still likely resign trout fishing to a distant third behind whitewater rafting/kayaking and cycling in terms of economic impact. That said, I’m optimistic that wild trout can and will be eventually established in the river.

The Yough truly is a special place!

 

[dryflyguy]

Just checked the USGS gauge for the tailrace. Water being released from the dam right now is still pretty cold - 59 degrees.
This after me - and several other forum members - posted earlier how the Youghiogheny runs out of cold water by September.

Very typical of how things go on that river.
Just when you think that you kind of got things figured out there, you find out that you really don't!

Guess this years drought resulted in a lot less water being let out of the dam.
With more cold water being saved up over the summer than usual.

Anyhow, some good news for a change