Suspicious Dumping

[osprey]

TomG..........is that the western pa Conemaugh? I'm not familiar with the kiski. I do know from asking around that the frac fluids , some of them , are made up at a central location and then sent out in plastic mesh enclosed containers , that's what Haliburton does in Indiana.

 

[tomgamber]

View Larger Map

 

[tomgamber]

If you zoom out in the pic above you can see the lot next to the river which I guess is what is being referred to.

interesting link... http://www.marcellus-shale.us/waste-treatment-corp.htm

Does that mean that any discharge from any of these is frack fluid...no...and this discharge is probably not either.


http://www.marcellus-shale.us/water.htm :-o

 

[odtfish]

http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/17976058/detail.html

 

[franklin]

odtfish wrote:
http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/17976058/detail.html

They have so much inaccurate info in that video I have to wonder if the rest is accurate?

 

[jdaddy]

Agreed and nothing makes us conservation minded people look like nut jobs when facts are screwed up constantly.

Man, it would be tough to be one of the tanker drivers having that ****** reporter asking those stupid questions. I am actually glad he took the high road.

 

[franklin]

jdaddy wrote:
Agreed and nothing makes us conservation minded people look like nut jobs when facts are screwed up constantly.

Man, it would be tough to be one of the tanker drivers having that ****** reporter asking those stupid questions. I am actually glad he took the high road.

I'm anxious to see these tankers that carry 180,000 gallons of water. That's 1.4 million pounds. Bet that thing squashes some bridges!

 

[gochs]

Regardless of hyperbolic reporting, this is a serious concern. This is one thing I feel is extremely important to regulate more closely.

I did a report for school on the drillings, but mainly did my research on the components of the frac water and how poorly managed drilling sites lead to disaster for local wildlife.

What's horrible is that different companies use different "recipes" for the frac water, so there could be pretty much anything being dumped into the environment. Some companies use a chemical that is basically anti-freeze.

I'm all for the drillings, but only if it's done in a highly regulated situation, which it's not. Wells rupturing, illegal dumping. It's disgusting.

 

[franklin]

gochs wrote:
Regardless of hyperbolic reporting, this is a serious concern. This is one thing I feel is extremely important to regulate more closely.

I did a report for school on the drillings, but mainly did my research on the components of the frac water and how poorly managed drilling sites lead to disaster for local wildlife.

What's horrible is that different companies use different "recipes" for the frac water, so there could be pretty much anything being dumped into the environment. Some companies use a chemical that is basically anti-freeze.

I'm all for the drillings, but only if it's done in a highly regulated situation, which it's not. Wells rupturing, illegal dumping. It's disgusting.

If you go here: http://www.dep.state.pa.us/dep/deputate/minres/oilgas/OGInspectionsViolations/OGInspviol.htm

You can see the types of violations that are being found during DEP site inspections. As we can see there are regulations being applied to drillers and inspections are occurring. Are they as detailed as required? Are they happening as often as we would like? Probably not but it shows there is a fair effort to police the sites and not the wild west that many would think.

Much of the media and other drilling critics like to throw large numbers around for the water need for drilling. To put some of these numbers in perspective a creek like Penns which probably has an average flow of 500 cfps through the year has a flow of about 319 million gallons of water a day. If we used 1% of that each day we could fill over 750 of those 4000 gallon tankers they are using to transport water.

 

[gochs]

The way I see it, yeah there are regulations. However, there has to be more stringent regulations. I understand accidents happen, but there have been way too many catastrophes in the past 7 or 8 years since they started drilling.

Like I said, I'm all for the drilling, but its not as safe as it can be. And i dont think it ever will.

 

[tomgamber]

franklin wrote:

I'm anxious to see these tankers that carry 180,000 gallons of water. That's 1.4 million pounds. Bet that thing squashes some bridges!

Perhaps they made more than one trip? :roll:

 

[franklin]

tomgamber wrote:

franklin wrote:

I'm anxious to see these tankers that carry 180,000 gallons of water. That's 1.4 million pounds. Bet that thing squashes some bridges!

Perhaps they made more than one trip? :roll:

The reported claimed each trailer carried 180,000 gallons of water. He was confused, those trailers are not designed to carry much weight. They are holding tanks which are used to fill up other tankers. They get blocked up on site. They hold about 19,000 gallons of water each.

 

[tomgamber]

He says "180,000 gallons in these trucks" after tell you there are 9 of them. At 20,000 each...

Start at 1:27 and try again.

 

[franklin]

tomgamber wrote:
He says "180,000 gallons in these trucks" after tell you there are 9 of them. At 20,000 each...

Start at 1:27 and try again.

I guess you could interpret that either way. He goes on to say they make as many as 40 trips a day. Those are not delivery trucks. They can't move when loaded with water. The rear axel is liable collapse along with the frame. The trucks carrying water to the sites are considerably smaller in capacity.

 

[tomgamber]

You need to listen pay attention. The smaller truck where he starts his stand-up are the transports, they put the fluid in the big tankers...one of the smaller trucks does this 40 times a day. He says this pretty clearly. I don't think its hard to follow. BTW these are parked on the river bank, within the flood plane. What are they gonna do when the ice jams hi and the water level rises above the top of the tankers and they can't move them. They will spill their fluid into the river through the vents that keep pressure from building up in the tanks. And it won't be the first tie this had happened.

Look, I'd love it if they could get to this gas in a safe manner without #OOPS#ing up our state. But they aren't even trying. Their methods are suspect and sneaky and there will be damage unless they change how they do their business.

 

[franklin]

tomgamber wrote:
You need to listen pay attention. The smaller truck where he starts his stand-up are the transports, they put the fluid in the big tankers...one of the smaller trucks does this 40 times a day. He says this pretty clearly. I don't think its hard to follow. BTW these are parked on the river bank, within the flood plane. What are they gonna do when the ice jams hi and the water level rises above the top of the tankers and they can't move them. They will spill their fluid into the river through the vents that keep pressure from building up in the tanks. And it won't be the first tie this had happened.

Look, I'd love it if they could get to this gas in a safe manner without #OOPS#ing up our state. But they aren't even trying. Their methods are suspect and sneaky and there will be damage unless they change how they do their business.

I think your the one missing the point Tom. The nine holding tanks which the reporter calls tankers are used to fill small trucks such as the two shown on the river bank. The holding tank trailers do not move when filled. You might also notice the two water haulers down by the river are at a boat ramp. The sign clearly says not to block the boat ramp, no water trucks. My guess is that the holding tanks are used when the boat ramp is busy. I'm a bit familiar with the equipment, my father designed trucks for 30 years including involvement with the model on the left with the white cab.

I would also mention that the holding tanks only hold river water so spillage would not be a concern other than some minor erosion. In the event of a flood or river ice they can be pulled out in a matter of a few hours.

 

[osprey]

I lived right on the Susq for years , an ice jam is the MOST dangerous thing to deal with , even more than high water , if the ice jams up just right it creates a blockage on the water that can cause very rapid rises of the water level , it can come up real fast and you might not have the time to move anything , they should deal with the issue BEFORE it happens , be pro-active , move them out of the flood plain when the ice-jam possibility exists , but like TomG says they don't even try , they'll let 'em there until something happens and then worry about it , TAKE THE EASY WAY OUT and they will get away with it unless we do something about it.