Questions on 4 piece rods

[bikerfish]

yep, it's for covering wraps.

 

[FrequentTyer]

afishinado wrote:
No one should drag your rod sections through the mud or sand, but I've never seen a rod returned because the ferrules were worn. I've seen many rods returned for repair because of stuck ferrules and ferrules broken when they came apart while casting or fighting a fish. I've used wax for decades and have never had any problems since, with either stuck or loose ferrules.

Finally, the major rod companies like Sage, Orvis and others recommend that paraffin be used on the ferrules. Some rod companies even give a container of wax to customers when they buy a new rod. Check out their sites.

Thanks for the information. That is really interesting to me since it goes against everything I thought was true. In fact, I thought that the theory behind stuck ferrules was that a bit of dirt or sand got on the ferrule and caused the jam. Anyway, I checked out some sites as you suggested and you were, of course, correct. I was surprised to see Orvis selling ferrule wax and recommending it. Sage likewise suggest the use of wax, and Scott (I think it was Scott but I neglected to save the link) suggested that wax was bad, but their special ferrule lube was okay.
I did find a lot of disagreement on the net with a lot of people making strong statements both ways, but that is pretty typical and meaningless. A lot of manufactures (e.g. LL Bean, TFO, Hardy) appeared to be silent on the topic. I did find the following from Winston to be interesting LINK :

"SHOULD I USE WAX ON MY FERRULES?
There is no right or wrong answer to this question. Many experienced fly fishers insist on this practice. Also, many experienced fly fishers insist against this practice. If the wax is applied and then cleaned after every other use on a consistent basis then we believe this can extend the life of the ferrule. Otherwise, the wax simply attracts dust and grime and can actually shorten the life of the ferrule."

So there is no right or wrong answer, but cleaning the wax off when you break down the rod is probably a good idea. I should point out that no one I came across suggested using wax on a new rod to keep the rod from casting apart. It was always suggested as a lubricant to prevent stuck ferrules. I still maintain that a properly designed ferrule should have a sufficient friction fit that it will not need anything applied to it, so if I bought a new 4 piece rod and it cast apart on me I would return it.

 

[NorthBranch]

I don't know if the paraffin wax helps or hurts the casting apart issue. I know I've always used it, and I think it helps both assembly and dis-assembly. However, being that I've always used it, I don't know for sure?

I do know that the times I had the rod cast apart were probably my fault. Once I took the time to reconnect it correctly... no more issues that trip. My concern with a 4 piece rod is that I would have two more chances to screw up. :lol:

 

[Phish_On]

I almost exclusively use 2 piece rods. Just my taste. I have never once casted a rod apart or had a section stick. Never put wax on the furles either. I just give them a good wipe/rub down every now an again. Seems to work for me.

 

[tomitrout]

Yet another reason to not fish plastic rods, have never had a cane rod come apart mid-cast.

 

[outsider]

I prefer 2 piece rods. Four piece rods are a pain in the butt to me. Just more stuff to come apart and mis-align in IMHO. Hard to transport a 2 piece rod? I don't do air travel to fish, and never owned a vehicle that couldn't carry a 2 piece rod.

 

[NorthBranch]

outsider wrote:
I prefer 2 piece rods. Four piece rods are a pain in the butt to me. Just more stuff to come apart and mis-align in IMHO. Hard to transport a 2 piece rod? I don't do air travel to fish, and never owned a vehicle that couldn't carry a 2 piece rod.

I agree outside, and that was some of my reasoning in wanting a 2 piece. However, my main concern was the effect that the 4 piece would have on the action/performance on the rod. The 4 piece Passport that I tried was really a nice casting rod, but the Imperial suited my casting style a bit better.

Anyhow, last weekend one of my old fly fishing buddies (who was glad I'm getting back into the sport ) came over with his 8'6" Zenith 4wt for me to try, and he wanted to try my Imperial.

The Zenith looked sweet and casted beautifully. Although, I didn't think there was a lot of difference between it and the Passport I tried. Of course, there will be a difference between an 8'6" 4 wt and a 9' 5wt anyway, so it was hard to compare.

Like my son, my buddy takes his ATV out to Potter Country and gets to fish some out of the way places. The 4 piece rod is nice to throw in the box on the back of the ATV. I'm going to have a 4 piece so I can join them. Even when broken down, my 6'6" rod won't fit in the box on mine.

 

[NorthBranch]

tomitrout wrote:
Yet another reason to not fish plastic rods, have never had a cane rod come apart mid-cast.

LOL... Many years ago I had an 8' 4wt Leonard (pre fire), and come to think of it, the rod never casted apart. However, I just never really like the slower action of the bamboo rods that I tried. However, I wish that I had never sold that rod, but times got tough for a while. :-(

 

[barbless]

What you DON'T want to use wax on: metal ferrules, as found on bamboo and early glass rods. And it pays to keep the metal clean and free of tarnish (I like to use Simichrome for the tough jobs, but all that's needed for regular maintenance is rubbing alcohol and a q-tip.)

Candle wax works fine for glass and graphite ferrules. If you find yourself using a rod with loose glass or graphite ferrules, beeswax will do as a temporary fix, in a pinch. That's because beeswax is stickier. But beeswax also picks up dust and dirt much easier than ordinary candle wax, so it's important to be careful about cleaning it off when you break down the rod. And it's important to get the problem fixed, before the tip blank starts to get stress cracks. If a spigot ferrule is fitting all the way up to the hilt between sections, it's too worn. There should always be a small gap, as there is with new rods.

The long-term fix for a loose glass or graphite ferrule is simple: clean the ferrule with a wet wipe and some rubbing alcohol or Coleman fuel (which should dissolve any wax residue that's on the male ferrule or the spigot.) Clean the female ferrule too, using a q-tip, because you will of course be fitting the ferrule into it after the repair.

Then mix up a little epoxy- or Permaflex, as suggested above- and coat the male/spigot ferrule. Give it a couple of minutes to set- but not enough time to harden. Then, while it's still wet, wipe it all off. A thin layer will remain, like 1/000 of an inch. The only thing you should notice is that the ferrule is darker where the epoxy has been applied. Let it harden completely. Then try fitting the rod again.

I've done this to a couple of different spigot ferrule rods, and that's all I've ever needed to do to the ferrule joints back to their original fit- the kind that leaves a little gap between the sections.

But if it's too loose, just repeat the process. And if you find that you've overdone it a little, just sand it down ver-ry carefully with #0000 steel wool or 2000 grit sandpaper. Once around, clean the ferrule, check the fit, until you get it.

I think that for the purposes of this repair, any good clear epoxy will do. I've used the 30-minute set epoxy with no problems.

Also, I was told once by a rod repair guy that it's always a good idea to use just a little more resin than hardener when mixing- too much hardener and epoxy tends to stay sticky. Err in the direction of 60% resin/40% hardener. Remember to mix thoroughly.