Erie Tribs fish

[ryguyfi]

Hello boardmembers,

I had my first steelhead fishing adventure last year and truely enjoyed it. In doing some research over the past year I have found a few scattered reports of fisherman pulling out the rare - large brown trout, and pink salmon (chinook). I'm just wondering if anyone on this board has had such luck, and how much of a rarity it is to catch either of these there.

Thanks!

 

[Acristickid]

RY- fished up there for a few years and have not caught one nor have I seen one being landed. My observation is probably rare.

 

[JackM]

It is fairly rare. I think I had a brownie on last year in Elk, but it got under a ledge and broke me off. I played it for a few minutes and had it near the surface at the distance of about 15 feet and it looked "different" enough that I thought it might have been a brown trout, but it might well have just been a particularly dark steelhead.

 

[jayL]

Pink salmon aren't chinooks. Chinook is the Indian name for king salmon.

I love fishing for the big brownies, though I've never landed one. It would be cool if they started a fishery in Erie.

 

[ryguyfi]

Thanks for the correction. I was wondering if there was any differentiation there. I read that they used to stock a breed of salmon that didn't take too well, so the steelhead then took over, but this was years ago. I also heard that parts of NY stock salmon and a few are caught in PA but very rarely. Don't know what species it is though.

 

[jayL]

I think they tried with cohos (silvers). Don't quote me on that though.

NY stocks kings, cohos, and (many fewer) atlantics in late ontario.

 

[David]

They used to stock heavily with the cohos and chinooks. I caught a citation size chinook when I was around 11 years old...and it was primarily coho when I first started fishing erie. From what I remember, they salmon migrated to canada to find colder water rather than return to the streams where they were planted. PA found a much better return on the steelhead, so went forward with that program. I know there are still catches every year of coho, chinooks, pinks (humpies), and browns...primarily in the fall...not in the winter and spring. Where these ones come from, I don't know. They may be strays from canada or new york. Maybe the offspring of the few that do successful spawn have a better homing mechanisms. I would suspect its a combination.
It is a rare treat to land anything other than a steelhead, but is certainly possible.

 

[RLeeP]

Some of what follows is from memory and may not be completely correct. I think it's fairly close though.

I think the Commission had a Coho program in conjunction with 3CU. In the mid to late 70's, I think
I think it may have been discontinued because: 1) the salmon (as they have elsewhere..) brought out a somewhat unsavory element of the angling public and things got a little zooey, and 2) I don't think they were getting a return on the smolts that would justify the effort/expense. Some of this, as I recall was blamed on the walleye, who chowed down pretty heavily on the smolt.

I also think a few of the clubs that were/are a loose part of 3CU kept at it with Chinook smolts well into the 80's and that eventually was abandoned as well.

My view was always good riddance to the salmon. The steelhead were sufficient and the salmon became a form of overkill, IMO..

Probably 15 or more years ago, I *think* I recall Bob Hetz of 3CU telling us at a TU meeting in Erie that somebody had taken a Pink (Chum) Salmon out of one of the tribs and there had been a scattering of others. I'm not sure though. So far as I know, the only lake with an active (any time recently) program for Pinks was Superior and that was a while ago, again IIRC.

So, it would have been possible for a Pink to end up in a PA trib this way given that I (again) *think* that the first steelhead that started showing up in Lake Erie were thought to have come down out of the Soo Rapids in the middle part of the last century.

I have no idea why a brown trout fishery has not developed other than to speculate that the right strains have not been tried. Certainly, with the number of catchable yearling browns the Commission puts in Elk alone each spring, the exposure is there. I know some browns are taken each year, but I don't know where they come from. Other than originally from Europe...

I don't mind it as is though.. I mean, where would they go? There's barely enough room in the creeks to hold the steelhead as is..

Enough is enough, IMO.

 

[salmonoid]

I saw a pink in the tubes on Elk and my brother saw one below the tubes and route 5 when I was up there a few weekends ago. I don't ever remember seeing pinks in years past - it must be an "on" year for them. I caught a coho in the lake my first steelhead trip ten years ago and also a coho in Elk at the waterfall hole above the access area. I have to say that some of the brutes of fish I've seen were salmon, although they were all beat up looking.

 

[JackM]

My understanding of the dynamic is that when the steelheads are schooled up in the lake, some of the other salmonoid species will attach themselves to the school out of confusion or what have you. You don't see large numbers together running the creeks but a few strays come in with the steelhead schools when those run. There seem to have been more reports of pinks this year and someone suggested that the populations are cyclical that way. Not sure about the truth of that last statement but who knows?

 

[Squaretail]

There was an article in PA Outdoor News a couple months ago that the PFBC is in fact considering starting a brownie program up there but I have heard nothing of it since.
I've never caught anything other than steelhead but saw a brownie in Walnuts crystal clear waters of a couple weeks ago with about a dozen steelies.

 

[ezpickins]

I've only been steelheading once - last year.

I saw a ginormous brownie landed - I'd guess it was a 8 or 9 pounder. So in my experience it happens all the time.

The guy that caught it had been landing steelie after steelie on egg flies. He got tired of that and started to experiment with different flies. As soon as he tied on a small black wooly bugger he hooked into that nice brownie.

I suspect if he had stuck with eggs - he'd never had gotten that brown trout to hit.

So - although they are not common, they are around. And I believe targetting them specifically might yield better results than fishing steelhead flies and hoping for a hookup.

 

[tomgamber]

Makes me wonder...are there reports of large Brown trout being caught in the lake in other times of the year?

 

[dano]

NY has been stocking brown trout into Lake Erie for the last 7-8 years. Many find the mouth of 20-Mile Creek from Oct to Dec.
Typical size of these returning fish average 16-22 inches with an occasional 30+ fish being reported. (took a 29 inch male in a ditch of a creek outside Dunkirk,NY)

According to Bob Hetz of 3CU, 40,000 brown trout are ready to be dumped into the lake off Erie County. These trout will be 8-9 inches. This is the start of the PA Lake Erie brown trout program.

Back in 1996, 20-Mile creek received a decent run of pink salmon in Oct. I saw more pink salmon caught in one day than I have in the last 12 years.

 

[FarmerDave]

Several years ago I heard or read that there is a small population of reproducing pink salmon in one of the Lake Erie tributaries. I'm not saying what tributarie or even which state or province it is in. I believe every other year a few are still caught in Ohio and PA which tells me they are naturally reproducing. It has to do with the life cycle, and I guess one year class was wiped out. Haven't heard much about them lately, but then, I haven't been steelhead fishing in a couple years.

Kings seem to be getting more common. I've seen a few caught in a couple of Ohio tribs as well as PA tribs. I've 'caught' two of them in Elk Creek.

One was very small, and shouldn't have even been there. Maybe it followed the steelhead in like Jack suggested. It was only about 12 to 14 inches long, and black as coal and acted sickly. I actually caught it with my bear hands to see what it was and quickly released it. I've never head of them spawning at that size.

The second one i "caught" on a rod and reel. I saw it first and targeted it. It got off at my feet, and I made no effort to grab it. However, I had a good enough look at it to see it was a King. I wasn't going to keep it anyway. Again, it was very dark, and not as big as one would expect for a King. It was about the same size as an average steelhead.

I've heard that although still very uncommon, the numbers of browns being caught in recent years has increased some. Definitely hearing more reports of them. they are stocked in the headwaters of Conneaut Creek as well.

 

[pcray1231]

I've not caught a salmon or a brown. I get up there maybe 1 or 2 weekends a year. I once saw a salmon in 20 mile, noone caught it. And saw a guy land a brown in Elk Creek.

The browns come from a few sources. First, they stock some of the streams in the spring with adult, normal sized trout. Mostly browns. Also, a few tribs of the tribs hold wild brownies. Some of them make it to the lake. Also, NY stocks brown trout smolts along with the steelhead in some Erie tribs, and some apparantly get lost and return to PA streams. Wherever they come from, some of them follow the steelies (and salmon in NY) into the streams and gorge on eggs.

I've seen nothing substantiated, but I heard the PFBC is getting more proactive with the brownies. Don't know if they'll stock fingerlings, or just more standard size with a slight genetics adjustment or something. Anyway, IF whatever they're trying to do works, it'll be a few years before we see the rewards.

Edit: ^^^Sorry, dano provided more information than I had.

 

[ryguyfi]

maybe one day the brownies will be stocked and we can look forward to this...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KxqDGr85XM&feature=related

 

[ryguyfi]

found this picture on another blog site


http://forums.fishusa.com/m_119181/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#119560

 

[Sylvaneous]

I caught one decent lake run brownie about 3 years ago and saw one pair of Chinoks about the same time. Not something to really expect.

And just as a reminder: no matter what, your best or only really good fishing will be with rain or runoff coloring the creeks. Some people just can't resist coming up here on a nice weekend. Wait for a crappy one about 3-5 days after another crappy day. That'll get fish up, allowed some to move more and then be murkey again and get them hitting. Remember to walk. Just wanted to remind you if you were only on the Erie tribs once. Make a trip worthwhile.

Syl