brookie streams that no one fishes

[k-bob]

another thread mentioned the subject of brookie streams that "no one fishes." it's speculation of course, but imho some brookie streams seldom see fishermen because people woudnt bother: the streams are small, require a hike, arent even on the natural repro list, dont stand out on a map, arent near a familiar brookie stream, etc.; no mention in a book or on the internet. never heard a fishermen mention them.

here is an example ... white house run, a lehigh trib in a separate tract of sgl 119 between highway 115 and the lehigh.. white house run is above the tree symbol in this image... it's brushy, tiny, not on nat repro, but is public and has some brookies. have to walk in, road is gated. no big deal, but there are a lot of these.

on the "extreme brookie fishing" thread, a lot of guys (Foxgap, Chaz, TB, PCray, WT2) had fished that stream, which I would have expected.. I doubt the same guys have fished this one, no particular reason to fish it really.

I fished white house run and of course saw no one. I doubt anyone had fished it for months or longer... little streams like this are common if you study maps...

so you dont really know for sure, but I think there are brookie streams that seldom see a fisherman... too much land in PA for all the streams with brookies to be fished very often...

 

[pcray1231]

Yeah, there are more than a few. I do think the older generations used to fish these kind of streams a little more, but now they sort of got "lost". That generation had a few "sages" of a given area, guys that have fished every nook and cranny of a region, but are clueless outside of their region.

My theory is that the information/internet age, combined with the vastly increased willingness to travel, has largely concentrated fishermen onto the "chosen" streams, leaving others to essentially be history. Nobody wants to fish stream "so-so" when they could be fishing a now super famous stream. Everyone now takes in a smattering of the BEST streams across the state and ignores the hidden little places.

I think it's a bad thing. The good streams see more and more pressure while so much of the state goes unnoticed. Our state's strength isn't a few spectacular streams. It's an overabundance of decent ones. And some of the most enjoyable times are fishing a lonesome stream and getting a feeling of how AWESOME PA really is with all these little gems that nobody else knows about.

Technology SHOULD work the other way. You can find the hidden ones like never before. In the whole spot burning debate, I support open knowledge. But not the type that say "there's a 25 inch wild brown in this particular hole on this particular stream". I also think that the main message board view on this is damaging. The one that says spot burning famous streams is ok because they're already burned, but naming a no-name is taboo. It just enhances this effect.

Rather, it should be sharing large lists of streams, and observations about them and how to find them. When people ask for streams in an area I know well, I usually give them 20 options and what I know about each, rather than rave and rave about a single stream. Spread em out! There's plenty of enjoyable water for all.

 

[k-bob]

"" Nobody wants to fish stream "so-so" ''

exactly... there are a lot of brookie streams that are not standouts in any way but still have some wild fish. Have never run into a fishermen on a stream like white house run. And I dont recommend WHR, really... it's not a gem, just an example of a stream that is public, has fish, and probably sees few fishermen.

 

[Stagger_Lee]

If creeks like this aren't listed with the state's fishing site (maps) and you find one; is there usually a good chance if you find a decent amt of natives in it if it is in an area that has a decent amt of water with natives in the area?

//Excuse my ignorance as excluding water temps ... I'm not up on the science behind what makes the stream healthy or not.

 

[k-bob]

if a stream is far enough north and there is no dam to cause the water to slow down and warm up, it my be cold enough for brookies.

MIke on PAFF mentioned that the state is finding brookies in a lot of unsurveyed streams...a list of every pa stream with wild brookies would be a long list.

many of these streams may be too small, brushy, remote, and average/unspectacular for most people to bother fishing, including many PAFFers, which is kind of the point... also the fish are small.

in most water levels, it isnt that difficult to figure whether there are wild brookies, can catch or see them...

if you see swampy headwaters in google earth, the stream may be more tannic/acidic from decaying plants, so the chances of brookies vs browns is higher.

if you see elevation changes or sharp bends on maps, there may be a pool there.

use the little "clock with green arrow pointing right to left" icon to get google earth to display a sat map from a time when the leaves are off the the trees... then use the little ruler to measure the width of the stream. less than 10 ft is tiny.

 

[Foxgap239]

And let me add this, if you are into catching fish and only catching fish, most of these streams are not for you. One of my favorite streams that k-bob graciously invited me to, did not fish well at all but my day was made (and to this day I continue to think about it) by the surprise 30 ft waterfall which neither of us knew was there.

PA has some amazing things to see but if you go to only the famous, well publicized ones, you'll only see them in pictures. I'm sure quite a few of you remember the picture of me below the falls with my bright orange hat on. Believe me, no matter how cool you thought that picture was, you definitely couldn't appreciate the true beauty of it unless you were standing where we were. I was guilty of only going to where I could park my car within sight (not really but not far off) and now I don't care to go back to the places as often. Try it, you'll like it.

Fox

 

[k-bob]

yeah nice to have a lot of places to try just in eastern PA.. probably not going to find big fish.

also agree with pat that technology (GPS, google earth, PASDA mapping site) has mede it easier to fish off the beaten path.

 

[k-bob]

these streams are all different, but here are bits of another small unlisted stream that has brookies. bigger pool is biggest pool in this section .... really tiny stream, and not easy to fly fish ... but there are much bigger and much better unlisted streams where I have still never seen a fisherman, or a sign of one...

 

[pcray1231]

Yeah, they're all different. Which is one of the cool things. Because if someone who's never done this type of fishing asks someone to describe a stream, they all "sound" so similar, but they're different in their own ways.

 

[henrydavid]

I was up river on the Lehigh just above that area on Saturday, most of the Lehigh tribs have native brookies. Did you get to the mouth of that run and if so what was the terrain like down there.

I think you were referring to SGL 19 rather than 119 which is a little south of that. I'd like to do some investigating in that area.

Thanks for posting this, besides being surrounded by private land, and having some short tracts of public, state forest and game lands, it's a nice area to investigate.

I sent you a PM in case you were interested in investigating more in that area.

 

[k-bob]

replied to pm, thanks. I think that this separate sgl parcel with white house run is in/named sgl 91. Did not start at the mouth, several hundred feet above.

http://www.portal.state.pa.us/portal/server.pt/gateway/PTARGS_0_2_126465_11363_0_43/maps/091B.pdf

 

[henrydavid]

lol, that's it 91 B, replied to your PM, and thanks

 

[geebee]

when i was a little kid, my folks used to take me for a walk in the woods on the weekends.

there was always strange things to see and hear, brooks to jump, bridges to play pooh sticks from...

but during the week, we used to go in the evenings to a big park and play on the swings and walk along the River Thames.

I always preferred the weekends....

I guess i never grew out of wanting the sense of wonderment and adventure, that's why i go and get lost in the woods.

The wild trout are just an excuse perhaps.

 

[henrydavid]

Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.

Henry David Thoreau

 

[BeastBrown]

Monroe, Carbon, Southeastern Luzerne, and lower Lackawanna have great, nearly contiguous tracts of State Forest, Parks, and Sgls for how close to the Poconos and Wilkes-Barre/Scranton the area is. There have been several recent acquisitions of sgl property in the area, as well as large tracts of land under easements.

Regarding the easements, I am not sure if you can fish some of the most conspicuous streams on these easements. Someone said that if they accept growing greener funds or other state and federal dollars they must let you on the property to walk if you ask.(Sounds a bit incorrect, I don't know though) No idea if you could claim a right to fish or hunt.

I like hunting because you get to see cool swamps and nice views where there may be no stream-you would never venture in these areas otherwise. Most hunting is just hiking with a gun- if you don't want to kill something, lol.

 

[PennKev]

I've caught wild trout in just about every stream that "seems" or "looks" like it should have wild fish.

I supposedly live in a part of the state that has almost no wild trout.

 

[JG63]

One of my favorite things to hear: "Thur ain't noe feesh in 'at thur crick!" - practically a sure fire assurance of the contrary (and no crowds).

 

[Mike]

You might be surprised by the sizes of the the streams (widths) where you will find greatest abundances of legal size brook trout per mile in Pa. At least one of them is not wide; I am not sure about the other. Big holes are not the key characteristic; nor is fertility.

 

[troutbert]

Mike wrote:
You might be surprised by the sizes of the the streams (widths) where you will find greatest abundances of legal size brook trout per mile in Pa. At least one of them is not wide; I am not sure about the other. Big holes are not the key characteristic; nor is fertility.

What is (are) the key characteristic(s)?

 

[Chaz]

You may never see an angler on many streams, even places like the Kettle Creek BTE area, but if you look for trails you will see that many are fished. I've fish Upper Kettle Many times, and have still not seen anyone else fishing it in the upper sections. I know they do because it's talked about, but I'm never seen them, now I've jinxed myself.