More Women?

[Fishidiot]

OhioOutdoorsman's recent thread pertaining to the issue of women on this site got me thinking about the whole issue of women in our sport. I am particularly interested in the opinions of those of you who have been at this game for a long time. I started fly fishing in the late 70s as a kid. It really seems to me that there are very few women in this sport and that the numbers of them have remained stable. I say this purely from my own empirical experience and also from the perspective of one who'd frankly like to see more women fly fishing. I recall that in the 90s there was a lot of media attention payed toward the suppossed large numbers of women taking up fly fishing. Even today, the covers of FF magazines display far more photos of women fishermen (usually a knockout, fortysomething holding a large salmon or steelhead) than I think is realistic. I'm convinced this is nothing more than an attempt to appeal to male customers (keen grasp of the obvious ). I just don't see many women on the stream - not back in the 80s, not after the "movie" in the 90s, and not now. It has been my experience that, if one does see a gal on the stream, esp if she's fishing by herself, she's probably very good at it (even more true for hunting). I have fished entire seasons on streams in PA and can probably count on the finger of one hand the times in a season when you encounter a woman fishing by herself. My guess is that women will remain a very small minority of FFers and that all the publicity about women joining this sport was nothing more than hype promoted by those with a stake in growing the number of FF customers. Is this your experience? Do you see more women on the stream than in past years? Are there any solid statistics on the number or percentage of women FFers?

 

[RLeeP]

It's an interesting topic... Although I've been doing this a while (since the mid-60's), I'm not sure my viewpoint is either representative or well informed given that the sport for me is pretty much a solitary endeavor. That is to say, the way I schedule my fishing time and the places I tend to frequent cause me to see few other anglers period, let alone fewer women. Certainly though, when I have spent time at well known destinations where the access and casting are fairly easy like Oil Creek or Fisherman's Paradise, I see more women. Most are there as part of a couple. Some are obviously accomplished but most seem only mildly interested in being there, at best.

I think it bears remembering that, all the C&R stuff and environmental awareness aside, this is at it's core a blood sport. This doesn't necessarily mean there is a gender bar, per se. I had an aunt who was probably the world's most efficient dispatcher of chickens when the time came to introduce them to the pot or roaster. She was very feminine, but had no problem running down chickens and snapping their necks all the live long day. But the way women are culturally conditioned, this blood thing is probably a factor in the lower participation levels. The same thing probably goes for women fishing alone. It sort of goes against the cultural grain as well as some of the notions about personal safety we instill in our daughters. In the 8 years I've been fishing Wisconsin, I've seen 2 unaccompanied female anglers. And one of them was a far better specimen of a man than I am...

I do agree though that when we do encounter a lone woman on the water, she is probably an accomplished fisherperson. And this makes sense to me. I see no reason a woman could not be seized with the same fever for this stuff as we are. And I'm sure some are. On top of that, the (on average) inherent capacity for stealth and grace in a woman probably makes them (again on average) better small stream anglers than men. If on top of that, they are also a southpaw and can easily cast to the "wrong" bank, they could very easily clean out a creek and in the end, it may be well that fewer of them do fish...

But I think it is mostly about what we as a society condition women to be and do. Just like an expert male needlepoint artist, they would have to break out of a cultural mold in order to excel and that probably helps keep their numbers down..

 

[FarmerDave]

"keen grasp of the obvious?"

It might make you go blind.



http://www.sportfish.co.uk/product/31891/Women_In_Waders_Calendar_2008.html

I don't think those are all fly fishing though, but i am an all tackle angler. Try this one.

http://www.sportfish.co.uk/product/31894/Sportfish_Fly_Girls_Postcards_Set_Of_10.html

By the way, wasn't Roosevelt (Rosey) Greer into needle point? You are probably too young to remember that monster of a football player. He was the original gentle giant. He was also the guy who tackled Sirhan Sirhan after he shot Bobby Kennedy. Hey, I'm 6'6" and 320 and even I wouldn't call him a sissy for doing needle point.

 

[pete41]

They make too easy a target for the disturbed male if they go alone or even with another woman.We like to think of ourselves as being protective of females but we are also what they mainly need to be protected from.

 

[Bruno]

wow pete. are you saying that women don't go to the woods because they are afraid of disturbed males ?

Take a walk around any city in the nation at night and you will see more weirdo's in one block than you ever will in the woods. Most of the women I know would take you to task on that statement. I'd pay ya a hundred bucks to say that to my wife. She'd laugh ya outta the room.

 

[troutbert]

I think there are more women flyfishing than when I began around 1970, but the number is still very low. You do see some women fishing at popular places such as Fishermans Paradise, the regs area on the Breeches etc. and most are fishing with husbands or boyfriends.

It's not really a new thing because Joan Wulff was winning fly casting tournaments back in the 1940s and I recall reading about a womens only flyfishing club in the Catskills "back in the day."

The number of women flyfishers occur at a far high ratio in magazine photos than they do on the streams. The magazines do this for the reason mentioned, to catch the attention of male readers. But also, the tackle manufacturers and the magazines would love to get more women into flyfishing.

If the number of women flyfishers equaled the number of men flyfishers, sales of tackle and flyfishing mags would increase tremendously, which would greatly aid a struggling business.

But that will never happen. My theory is that women are generally less obsessive about fishing than men not so much for cultural reasons, but for biologically based reasons. The brain chemistry of men and women is different. I think the difference is hard-wired.

 

[onemorecast]

This topic brought me out of lurk mode.

I am a woman. I've been fishing my whole life, albeit passively. Usually accompanying my brother or father. Dad's been gone for 10 years now and I hardly see my brother. So, when the fishing bug caught up with me a few years ago, I started fly fishing alone.

I've gotten most of my fishing education from the "fly shop guy" that sold me my first fly rod, internet forums and one guided trip in NJ. I do alright but have a long way to go.

It was not easy for me to get started in this alone. I had to work up some fair amount of courage to get out there on stream, practicing the things I had learned, in front of other more accomplished male anglers. But I stuck it out and don't mind looking like a fool every once in a while, mostly because the internet forums have taught me that there are TONS more guys out there who don't know what they're doing!

I think I would have felt much more comfortable learning this sport had I been part of a couple. I have to admit that for me, playing in the "boys' sandbox" was a bit intimidating.

As for fishing alone, I do limit myself to more accessible and popular places. I won't do any back country mountain stream hiking. The most remote I'll go is the Big Flat Brook in NJ and only on a weekend.

I wouldn't call myself obsessed, but I have been sick for a week and a half (part of that hospitalized) and I am jonesing pretty bad to get out there. If that's any indication.

 

[pete41]

I fished Flat Brook about 45 years ago-If you can catch them there You have impressed the heck out of me-I got skunked.lol
Do you ever fish down in the Delaware?

 

[jayL]

I actually gave some instruction to a nice woman on a Berks county stream last spring. There was a strong sulphur hatch going on, and she was watching me fish while she sat on a blanket. She eventually approached me with some questions about the hatch, the gear I was using, etc. She then proceeded to produce a beautiful, expensive fly rod and began casting. I gave her some CDC sulphurs and she ended up missing a few fish.

Her story was pretty touching. She had a husband that loved to fly fish. She never took any interest at all in his hobby. He died in a car accident a while before I met her, and she decided that rather than sell his gear or let it sit idle, she'd learn to fish. Naturally, I was happy to give her plenty of flies and help her a good bit.

 

[mediclimber]

I have yet to run across any women fishing when i'm out. I did meet two women last summer at a fly shop who were headed down to the Keys to try their hand at Tarpon and Barracuda. I have done quite a bit of backpacking for long stretches, like five plus days at a time, and did run across some women on some of my hikes. They were laid back and nice to talk to over a cup of coffee or tea at a campsite. I think we men seem to make this look and sound more difficult than it is possibly so we can get our "private time".

 

[Sylvaneous]

I have seen a surprising number of what I believe to be female couples on Penns creek. Now, only a few times, but it really stands out in my mind. Actually, I have seen a comparatively fair number of female anglers, proportionally, on Penns and Oil Creek. Not so much elsewhere, but then, I fish Penns and Oil Creek more than any other trout streams that are anything anyone would have heard about.

 

[littlejuniata]

I have seen some attractive chicks fishing, no problem here, just got to check before you take a leak.

 

[OhioOutdoorsman]

I saw and have seen lots of women, usually coed couples, out west and the smoky mountains, but very rarely in NW PA and the Ohio tribs.

 

[troutbert]

For women interested in flyfishing, here are some web resources to check out.

http://www.womensflyfishing.net/clubs.htm For listings of groups all over.

In the SE PA area, check out:
Delaware Valley Women's Fly Fishing Association. www.dvwffa.org/

In the mid-state area (Centre County etc.), check out: http://www.flyfishersparadise.com/
Their home page has something about womens flyfishing. There was a women's flyfishing group in this area in the past, and I think they are trying to revive it.

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear fishidiot,

I've been fly fishing since the late 1970's and I can count on one hand the number of women I have seen fly fishing in Pennsylvania. It's been years since I've seen a solitary women out fly fishing, the last time was a snowy late February day on Spring Creek in the late 1990's.

Having said that, I've probably fly fished as much and maybe more with women in the last two years than I have with guys. One of those is the wife of a fishing buddy and she almost always accompanies him on trips. The other is a friend I met through another message board. Her husband doesn't fly fish but she fishes for trout, bass and saltwater fish with the fly rod.

Both of these "fisherwomen" that I have fished with are skilled anglers.

Regards,
Tim Murphy

 

ONEMORECAST:
It's really nice to have you speak out, here on these boards, as very, very, few women have done so, up this point!

So, "welcome in from lurking" I'm glad you're here! I hope that you feel comfortable, enough here, to contribute as often as possible!

For me, maybe I just "fish in the right places", because I seem to run into ladies fly fishing quite often on the water. I think a lot of it, is due perhaps, to the fact there are several very good "all female" fly clubs in my immediate vicinity. (Oregon-Washington).

One, close to my home club, has a pretty good membership count and I run into their members when fishing quite often.

"The Stone Fly Maidens", is a very prominent all female fly group that our club, "The Rainland Fly Casters", joins forces with,occasionally , on a lot of conservation projects covering our local streams and lakes. A fantastic group of women that really are into fly fishing, but also, very dedicated to conservation, fishing regulations on the Capital level and any and all, areas of fly fishing.

Although, we do it strictly for fun, with none of the "We/they are better than you/us", we also hold competitive fishing outings and casting contests, etc. against these ladies a couple times each year.

Yes, they've slaughtered us, in BOTH the fishing outings AND the casting competitions a few times, too!

Since I guess, I always believe that; "You never stop learning, no matter how long you've been doing something", I've attended this club's fly tying meetings and rod building classes a couple of times and picked up some very handy and useful tips, in both areas. (I've been rod building, 20 years and tying for nearly 28. Most of them, have been doing each, for less than 6 or 7).

Although, obviously "dominated by men", merely because of the sheer numbers of us, versus the gentler sex, I still don't believe that "fly Fishing Is A Man's Sport", or, that "I'm Glad To See More Females "Coming Into OUR Sport", because it's NOT "OUR sport", really! But, I am glad to see when the numbers start to become more balanced.

 

[shakey]

i have only seen four women fly fishing .one ,of course, is my own girlfriend who presents a dry fly now and then.her mother has a house on a lake ,so she gets some practice now and then.she did very well on connecticuts salmon river this year.

two other women i saw were a couple fishing valley creek,one of them was very skilled and she was teaching her friend.they were both very nice.we swapped some flies.

i once met a women on pickering creek who was dressed head to toe in brand new orvis.if you took audrey hepburn,joan fontine ,olivia dehaviland,and maybe jessica alba,mixed them up they would come out uglier than this girl.she asked"isn't it a nice day?"i said"ffffffffffllllllbbbbbsssssssst flu flub."

 

[pete41]

Lets stop making reference to womens looks and maybe some will join in the forum talk.

 

[onemorecast]

I can't help but agree. I didn't get into fly fishing to find a man, so I don't like the thought of being compared to a women in waders calendar. I'm just in it for the fish - it's not a beauty contest.

With that said, I know that boys will be boys. I thought Shakey's comments were pretty funny.

 

[shakey]

thanks! and i certainly didn't mean to be offensive,it was just one of the ways this particlar angler is remembered from the others i've met on streams.

love the flatbrook BTW.i caught my first "on purpose"trout there.