Global warming?

[FarmerDave]

Here is a new spin that I've been hearing more and more about.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23583382-5009760,00.html

The purpose of me posting this is not to argue whether global warming is real or not (I feel it is) or whether or not man has contributed (I feel we have). However, this is not the first article that shows that the climate has cooled over the last couple years.

However, I do find it hard to believe that the sun has minimal effect on climate change as the one study says.

 

[Fredrick]

The way I see it is if the threat of climate change is going to scare everyone to improve co2 emissions than i'm all for it truth or fiction :-D

 

[tabasco_joe]

Fredrick wrote:
The way I see it is if the threat of climate change is going to scare everyone to improve co2 emissions than i'm all for it truth or fiction :-D

If it's fiction why do you want everyone to pay billions to reduce CO2?

 

[FarmerDave]

Given that Methane is a much more potent greenhouse gas, I need to know whether or not the eat more or less beans.

 

[Fredrick]

ACID RAIN thats why :-o

 

[Fredrick]

ACID RAIN thats why :-o

Given that Methane is a much more potent greenhouse gas, I need to know whether or not the eat more or less beans.

Don't forget about BEEF

 

[littlejuniata]

Something is causing the destruction of one of most necessary resources, POTABLE WATER!! That plus streamflows are way below historical data levels. Even locally we have streams disappearing during dry periods. Can anyone imagine how much gasoline is WASTED, shipping bottled water around, let alone the billions of drink containers ending up in landfills.

 

[Padraic]

Of course Dr. Chapman doesn't actually hold a degree in climatology. He's an astronaut and a rocket scientist, which is very cool.

I think you have to be careful who you are going to listen to. Here's an article (http://tinyurl.com/676af4) that says cigarette smoking isn't so bad for you and even has short term health benefits.

"There are lies, damn lies and statistics...."

 

[albatross]

Pad,

Like any other powerful weapon, statistics can be used for good or evil.

 

[MattBoyer]

Remember, liars can figure, but figures don't lie. :-D As far as the bottled water goes, my wife picked up a case of bottled water at Giant the other day. As I am drinking a bottle at work I just happen to catch the label. The more carefully I look at it the more amazed I am. It was bottled in Ontario,CA, distributed through Landover, MD, and the source springs were in Tower City, Auburn, and Pine Grove, PA. Talk about a carbon footprint for something that came from my back yard. I think I'm gonna get a few of those britta portable training bottles and bottle my own, or maybe just carry a canteen.

Boyer

 

[SpottedCharr]

When I have my way, all polluting machines will be destroyed.

What have we gained that has made all of this worth it? Convenience? Now we sit on our asses more, get fat and enjoy a nice heart attack or stroke. Cheaper goods? What satisfaction do you find buying a shirt made in China - makes me a little sick inside whenever I do. Power? We build the ugliest structures that belch tons of black smoke so we can wash our clothes in an electric machine while we watch american idol.

I know little of global warming. But I'm sick inside for our destruction of natural beauty in exchange for NOTHING!

I stand accusing myself here. I've been a hypocrite. But one day, all that I do will be for the benefit of ALL living creatures on earth. Machines be damned!

jon

 

[ian_brown]

Jon,

I share your desire for a simpler existence, but I cannot agree that we need to destroy "all polluting machines."

For example, helicopters create a ridiculous amount of pollution, but I'm glad we have medivac crews saving lives every day. Healthcare pollutes (think about how much plastic is created and thrown away), but I feel very lucky to live in a time and place where medicine actually works. Hell, I'm glad I've had the chance to fish the Delaware, Gunpowder, Spring Creek, Penn's Creek, Little Lehigh, Tulpohocken, etc, although my carbon footprint would have been far lower if I'd spent those days with my car parked in the driveway and my butt parked in front of the tube.

We definitely need to be smarter about how we use our natural resources. Even with all the challenges we face, in the grands scale of things this is a pretty fantastic time to be alive.

 

[SpottedCharr]

It's a process, Ian. I can't stop using my car just yet either. And I too am grateful for modern medicine and helicopter rescue.

But is "compromise" really necessary? Perhaps we've been sold a lie...Perhaps there really is a way to have the best of both worlds - like heaven on earth. And this prompts another question. Why must we sacrifice all for the sake of function and efficiency? And why isn't beauty a function in itself? It is to me.

We must stop excusing ourselves. We have no right to harm one another and little right to harm lesser living creatures. Once the excuses stop, then we can develop a practical strategy for restoring earth.

One day I will part with my black, 1999, Jeep Sahara Wrangler. I love it. But in the end, it must cease polluting.

 

[tabasco_joe]

I guess it all depends on what your comparing against. 50 years ago the air and water quality in the US was many, many times worse than today. From that perspective we are making a lot of progress and it's continuing. There will always be some pollution. You produce pollutants. The challange is managing them in a way that is sustainable. Nature itself is violent and at times produces what we would call pollutants. Think of what a volcano puts out or even a natural forest fire.

 

[FarmerDave]

SpottedCharr wrote:
It's a process, Ian. I can't stop using my car just yet either. And I too am grateful for modern medicine and helicopter rescue.

But is "compromise" really necessary? Perhaps we've been sold a lie...Perhaps there really is a way to have the best of both worlds - like heaven on earth. And this prompts another question. Why must we sacrifice all for the sake of function and efficiency? And why isn't beauty a function in itself? It is to me.

We must stop excusing ourselves. We have no right to harm one another and little right to harm lesser living creatures. Once the excuses stop, then we can develop a practical strategy for restoring earth.

One day I will part with my black, 1999, Jeep Sahara Wrangler. I love it. But in the end, it must cease polluting.

Hmmm. that sounds like the plot for a couple of 70s B movies I once saw. Like Ian said, I also share your desire for a simpler existance. In fact, i have been moving in that direction for several years. Bought a farm, raise a lot of my own food... But what you seem to be suggesting is we should all live on vegan communes and follow PETA doctrine. ...and even if we did, we would still have impact.

Don't get me wrong. I hear what you are saying, and we are all hypocrites to some extent when it comes to this stuff. But everything is relative, therefore everything is a compromise. The bottom line is that there are now over 6 billion people on this earth. That is a whole lot of people and a whole lot of impact on the environment, and the number keeps growing. The planet can only take so much.

The only way to eliminate all human impact is to eliminate all humans. You go first. :-D

Then again, if we did that, there would be nobody around to notice. :-D

 

[SpottedCharr]

Well said to all. I don't know my own direction completely except that it leads to a simpler life. I have no fondness for PETA or any other oranization centered around an idea. That's a trap in itself. PETA goes around and raises money to fight the machines that make money. They've gotten on board.

But anyone can choose not to play along and they will evolve into a higher awareness of and connection to nature. The only battle is in yourself.

When each of us has done this, we will see life in a whole new light.

Long live salvelinus fontinalis!