Sacrificials

[ezpickins]

As i sit down for some winter tying one of the first things that I do is tie up a bunch of sacrificial flies. Sacrificial flies are those that I tie on when you suspect you may not get them back. Easy to tie, cheap, heavy, and effective are all prerequisites.

They fill up the box quickly and I know I'll need them in the spring with high water.

I often go to an "all-peacock" nymph for this. I heavily weight an eagle-claw hook(non fly-tying, but sturdy and cheap). Grab some peacock, tie it in leaving some for a tail, wrap the body, trim the herl leaving some to imitate legs.

Cheap and easy - and effective.

So, when you need to get deep and on the bottom and know that you're going to be losing a lot of flies what do you tie on?

 

[shipnfish2006]

Green weenies or an oversized caddis larvae tend to fit that description for me.

 

[jayL]

Muskrat nymph/walt's worm. I use them in snaggy places, and always use one as my weight fly in a tandem.

 

[Rkey530]

A freind of mine who unfortunately isn't doing well right now had a similar fly to the one you described. I've always called it Keegan's Killer after him.
Curved nymph hook. #14-18. Nut looking tungsten head. Lead underwrap optional. Either no tail or some brown antron 1/2 the length of the shank. Tie in a bunch of peackock. Head cement the entire body and wrap the peacock over the wet cement to the tungsten. Trim all excess peacock. Whip finish and thats it.
They are down and dirty to tie, bulletproof, and get to the bottom quick. I've had relatively little luck with them. Keegan could catch every fish in the stream on one before lunch. Then again he can tell me how most of the streams around here fished before WWII, so i'm not going to feel to badly about myself over it.
As a personal choice for getting deep and losing flies in the early season I still tie Bead head prince nymphs with all the bells, wistles, biots, and soft hackle involved. They work for me. Painfull, but they work.

 

[MKern]

I just use crappier flies I tied long ago.

OR

A caddis larva ties with "EZ Dubbing."

 

[FlySwatter]

Funny, I was JUST thinking about this.

Let me know what you all think about these points:

1) If you tie your anchor fly on a scud hook and weight the bend (and tie it in the round) the hook will ride point up and you'll loose fewer flies. Would adding a bead negate this and cause the hook point to ride down?

2) If you tie the point fly in a brignt color (like a green weenie) it will get noticed and maybe draw more attention to the more imitative flies on droppers above the bright fly.

3) If your sacraficial fly is an anchor (and I'm sure it is) is it better to coat most or all of it with something like epoxy or HAN to make it more hydrodynamic?

I know, I'm probbly overthinking this. Frankly, I'm working WAY too much right now and my mind is grasping at something other than work to think about.

I look forward to your feedback.

thanks,
Mike

 

[MKern]

swatter,

not sure on the weight to the bend thing, but I always use a big flashy fly (usually a sz 12 beadhead flashback pt) as my point fly and more "hatch specific" flies as my trailing line-up.

 

[jayL]

1. I don't think so, but not sure.

2. I have used this technique before, and will use it again. I wouldn't say it's for using 100% of the time, but in situations where you think it helps, it can't hurt.

3. Many anchor patterns are tied like this. The Vladi worm comes to mind. I still prefer a buggy walt's worm for an anchor, but that's because I like to incorporate a shot spread as well.

 

[afishinado]

FlySwatter wrote:
Funny, I was JUST thinking about this.

Let me know what you all think about these points:

1) If you tie your anchor fly on a scud hook and weight the bend (and tie it in the round) the hook will ride point up and you'll loose fewer flies. Would adding a bead negate this and cause the hook point to ride down?

2) If you tie the point fly in a brignt color (like a green weenie) it will get noticed and maybe draw more attention to the more imitative flies on droppers above the bright fly.

3) If your sacraficial fly is an anchor (and I'm sure it is) is it better to coat most or all of it with something like epoxy or HAN to make it more hydrodynamic?

I know, I'm probbly overthinking this. Frankly, I'm working WAY too much right now and my mind is grasping at something other than work to think about.

I look forward to your feedback.

thanks,
Mike

All good thoughts:

1. No, even with a bead it will ride hook point up. Check it out for yourself.

2. Unless the water is low and clear or I'm trying to imitate a hatch in progress, I will usually tie on an attactor fly along with a more natural nymph.

3. Czech nymphs are almost always "hydrodynamic" as you post. That would probably work well. I often cheat and make one of my "flies" a string of split shot on the rig. I find that trading adjustability of SS often outweighs having one less fly on the line. Don't forget, you can always add another fly to make up for the shot.




One final thing, until I read this post the thought of a "sacrificial" fly never crossed my mind. I fish the same way, no matter what fly I tie on.

 

[RLeep2]

The only place I've tied/used a fly like that is in Oregon, where FFO regs mandate no added weight on the leader, but you can put as much weight in your fly as you want.

I'll take local friends who are only occasional anglers over to the hatchery section of the Fall River outside of Sunriver and have them fish a small PT or olive nymph or a dinky egg fly on a 6X tandem behind a muskrat nymph on a #16 hook that is just a lead dumbbell eye lashed to the hook and then figured-eighted with muskrat fur.

It gets down in the water column where it needs to be and more often than I would have thought, the fish will take the muskrat nymph in preference to the fly they're supposed to take.

 

[ezpickins]

FlySwatter on 2009/12/16 14:09:52

Please don't confuse anything I say with gospel truth, I hesitate to play at expert, I'm a rank amateur compared to some - but I'll make some comments anyway... :-D

1) If you tie your anchor fly on a scud hook and weight the bend (and tie it in the round) the hook will ride point up and you'll loose fewer flies. Would adding a bead negate this and cause the hook point to ride down?

I can't comment on the bead question - but another thing you can do if using a standard nymph hook is to bend the hook down near mid-shank or so, this will put a "keel"in the hook - and I believe this will cause it to ride "point-up". I haven't scuba-dived to observe this but it's what I've heard anyway.

2) If you tie the point fly in a brignt color (like a green weenie) it will get noticed and maybe draw more attention to the more imitative flies on droppers above the bright fly.

I guess we'll never know for sure what the fish think, but I've caught plenty of fish on the green weenie. So using it as an attractor probably couldn't hurt. I do usually mix and match though - if using more than one fly I'll try an attractor type color with a more natural fly to play the odds. Who knows though for sure.

3) If your sacraficial fly is an anchor (and I'm sure it is) is it better to coat most or all of it with something like epoxy or HAN to make it more hydrodynamic?

Flies designed to sink more quickly are probably a good idea - but I wouldn't limit that to expoxied or otherwise coated flies. I think a fairly slim profile is probably a good idea though. The czech-nymphs are a good example, they are designed to sink quickly. To be truthful I'm usually too lazy to get the epoxy out.

I know, I'm probbly overthinking this. Frankly, I'm working WAY too much right now and my mind is grasping at something other than work to think about.

Please continue to over think! I'm surely guilty of it - does it help me catch more fish (who knows maybe not). But I enjoy over thinking it.

 

[troutslammer]

latex caddis is a great fly for a sacrificial , it wacks em too , very easy and cheap to tie

 

[bam]

I actually like my point fly or flies to be lighter or unweighted wets/nymphs/emergers. Not sure if I lose more flies this way, but I think weighting the top fly and letting the trailers swim and tumble in the current creates a more natural presentation. My junk flies are usually weighted walt's worms or simple nymph patterns tied size 14 or larger.

 

[osprey]

I sacrafice small wooly buggers by the dozen in the spring , put appropriate shot above fly about 2-3 inches , mend to get it deep and do the lift.

 

[whheff]

I use a small size 16 or 18 PT with shot about 6" above it in fast water prospecting and a heavy weight wolly bugger with a sink tip in the high fast dirty water we had after last weeks rain.

Both are cheap and easy flies to tie.

 

[troutslammer]

go to a pharmacy and get those little rubber finger boots , cut them into about 1/8 strips , put your bead on , tie in the latex at the hook bend , wind it toward the eye , tie it off with several wraps of black thread right at the base of the bead , looks like a ribbed caddis , cheap and easy just the way we like em boys ...lol

 

[sandfly]

All of my flies are sacrificial to the fish, rock and tree gods.

 

[MKern]

BTW,
Like sandy, I'd use any fly in my arsenal (no matter how elaborate or time consuming to tie) to catch any fish.

 

[LouM]

Sandfly forgot to mention the flies he cuts off of other peoples tippets while fishing with them

 

[osprey]

AMEN.......whatever it takes , even the WHOLE chicken heh