caddis larvae

[flipnfly]

ok this is one thing that im totally in the blind about and need to fix since caddis are a food staple to trout .

my questions are

1. are the larvae patters the same size as the dry
2. are the larvae the same colors as the dry?

so if im fishing where there are lil black caddis hatch is the larva going to be a size 16 or 18 black larvae? this is what im confused about and i know im making this harder than it is .....
or are all caddis larvae green?

your help will go a long way

 

[flipnfly]

and another question after reading some materials online

do most streams have "free-living " caddis or hydrosyche?

 

[afishinado]

yes and no...lol. Very complex answer to your questions. Here's an article with some basics on caddisflies. Good luck.

http://www.fishbc.com/adventure/angling/bugs/caddisfly/caddisfly.phtml

 

[jdaddy]

flipnfly wrote:
ok this is one thing that im totally in the blind about and need to fix since caddis are a food staple to trout .

my questions are

1. are the larvae patters the same size as the dry
2. are the larvae the same colors as the dry?

so if im fishing where there are lil black caddis hatch is the larva going to be a size 16 or 18 black larvae? this is what im confused about and i know im making this harder than it is .....
or are all caddis larvae green?

your help will go a long way

Well, there is a huge family of caddis, so there is not one generic answer. Case builders, free living, net spinners, etc will have different ratios of larvae : adult ratios. But overall, yes, the expansion of the body kind of makes up for the loss of the exterior shell.

No, larvae are typically not the same color as the dry, however there are so many variances you would have to investigate each caddis you have in your stream at any given time.

Check out troutnut.com for some pretty in depth information on all things bugs.

http://www.troutnut.com/hatch/1916/Caddisfly-Hydropsyche-Spotted-Sedges

 

[flipnfly]

ok a little easier question the caddis that i normally fish are as follows grannoms on the neshannock which i presume are dark grannoms , lil black caddis on laurel hill and tan caddis on the youghiogheny so if i tie light olive , dirty cream, and bright green larva and bright green and amber deep sparkle pupae and olive and brown sparke pupae and tan and gingerof each i should have my basis covered? w0w ive got some tying to do not to mention the adults and egg laying grannoms who would have thought figuring out which spectrum of flies to have could be so tough the dries are much easier to figure out as well as mayflies IMO



ps
all that latin on trout nut is turning my brain into mush....

 

[troutslammer]

most caddis larvae are bright green i would say , tie the lafontaine sparkle pupa and u are fine. tie some hares ear and pt wets and u are covered. at certain depths in the water trout see only grey and black from the research i have done so it is about profile at certain depths and color at more shallow depths. if there is caddis coming off the water don;t do like many guys and fish a larvae pattern , they are pupating before emergence. a simple pupa patters is a size 14 caddis hook , brass bead , black dubbing with a wire rib or white thread rib.

 

[MKern]

If you are trying to match under the surface flies when you see dries you'll have to keep in mind that there is another stage in the llife-cycle between: pupa; which a whole nother ball game.

 

[joereese]

I'm with midnight. I mostly fish larvae in olive (haretron #6) or caddis green (haretron #14). I carry some tan (natural hares ear) and fish those too, but in central PA I do much better with olive or green even when there is a good number of tan in the stream. Those bright candy apple green versions you see online are from the cased larvae family (ie. grannom larvae) and do take fish as much (although they do) because they almost never appear in the stream free swimming. they pupate in the case. The green, olive and tan are free living variety and are a greater source of food.

The best way to decide is turn over some rocks in the creeks you fish and fish that color AND size you see. Size 14 is a good generic size and catches fish year long; however, I have found that smaller (16 and 18) are a must have size between july and January. If you turn over the rocks you'll see that after the major emergence there are a greater number of the small larvae around.

I admit, I never tried black.

Simple tip: when the caddis are out, fish a soft hackle and larvae combination. When you get more specialized you fish this combo leading up to the hatch. During, a combo of dry and soft hackle.
Also, remember that some caddis don't hatch or emerge on the water. Some of the more abundant species crawl out (like the green caddis that emerges with the sulphurs). Look down on your waders when fishing the sulphur hatch at dark, you'll be covered in them. At this time, the softhackles kills them

As for grannoms: A wet fly (lead wing coachman or peacock and partridge) will out fish a dry 5 to 1. Especially the larger trout.

 

[bam]

I'm with midnight and joreese, but have found that a large green or olive czech nymph, size 6 or 8, caught me fish that a small caddis has never produced.

I never carried caddis larger than a 14 till I was turning over rocks one day and found a couple of the large free living guys. They were almost non-existant compared to the cased and small caddis but since they were so big, I just hooked one onto a small PT and wham... 18 inch fish. I tried several nymphs and subsurface flies in that particular run with no luck before I started looking for clues under rocks. At that point I looked for another one hooked it to my PT and caught a 16 inch fish. A couple days later I came back with a couple caddis style cezh nymphs and caught several more browns up to 20 inches.

I wouldn't reccomend this approach during grannom season, but don't overlook them if they're they're around. I just know next time I hit that perticular stream, I'll be well armed

 

[bam]

Look down on your waders when fishing the sulphur hatch at dark, you'll be covered in them. At this time, the softhackles kills them

Took me a while to find it, but you mean like this

I was fishing the Yough last year in July and I was getting skunked, as were all the bait/spin guys around me. Nothing was coming off, but when I walked back into shallow water I looked down and this is what I saw. Then I smiled and tied on a soft hackle. Gave the guy standing next to me one and told him to fish it a foot above his shot just as if he were fishing bait. He caught three on consecutive casts before losing the fly. Unfortunately I had to go visit my parents, my reason for being out there, but on my way out I gave him the two remaining soft hackles in my box.

What I found odd is how they would crawl back down my waders and into the water as I retreated to shore. I'm guessing they weren't ready to come off just then? I'd have loved to stick around for a couple more hours to see what happened.

 

[flipnfly]

sounds good guys thanks i think i have aplanned attack that should cover most of the waters i fish.... i appriceate the advice

 

[flipnfly]

i also would be willing to bet that a micro hares ear would be a good producer any opinions ?

 

[joereese]

Your story inspires me to give a larger sized larvae a try later this spring. I guess I usually would imitate these meaty morsals with a walt's worm.

Oh for those looking at the pic, the wings appear tan and you might think about using something light for the wings. They are not usually tan. They appear lighter in the photo because the sheen on the wings are reflecting the flash. If you tie softhackles to imitate these crawlers, use dark or brown partridge. better yet a brown mottled hen back for the hackle. the wings on these are dark. Tie the hackle on a tapered base so that the fibers lie closer to the body, rather than flaring out like you'll see on more standard SHs like an orange and partridge.

Micro hares ear: for nymphs 18 and smaller I prefer to use tying thread for the bodies, bead head and a thorax built up with thread or dubbing. No legs, no wing case

 

[flipnfly]

here are some of the micro nymphs and caddis larva i have come up with

 

[flipnfly]

i still think for size 16's my caddis larvae are too fat

 

[joereese]

IMO, I agree too fat. I a fan of slender bodies with an undersized bead. 2.4 mm on size 14 or 2.0 mm on sz 16

an example

 

[David]

Again, it depends. Just in the limited selection of pictures posted in this thread, one is short and stubby...much like you tied...while the others are more slender. And it varies by profile. Catch a view from the top and they are wider, catch a view from the side and they are thinner.
They'll all catch fish.

 

[flipnfly]

i tied up a few czech style size 10 too i dont want to tie too many until i get my lead tape