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Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2008/1/26 11:59
From ridley
Posts: 52
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Hey man , Fishing is fishing! If it is a pay per fish stream or a charter boat down the shore, it is still fishing. If this gentleman wants to pay for the right to fish , I am ok with that. With that point there are plenty of great streams that are free and open to the public. I think that if you caught a wild 20 incher it would be alot more rewarding then a stocked 20.I have to admit , I spend alot of time on charter boats down the shore.

Kheher01 THANKS FOR THE POST

Posted on: 2009/5/5 11:36
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Thinking about the release!


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
Posts: 19932
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fishrich,

I have a hard time equating a charter boat or guided trip on public water with fishing a private stream. Two completely different concepts. I certainly enjoy taking a chartered boat out in the ocean or on a large lake.

As you said, it's just fishin.

Posted on: 2009/5/5 12:08


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2006/12/3 21:01
From Mechanicsburg, Pa
Posts: 479
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I am not sure why everyone is coming down on this guy. I enjoyed his report even though I'll probably never fish that creek. I have seen reports for streams were public access is not available or limited and no one makes a peep. I wonder sometimes why a few on this board are quick to judge and critical. Any one who trout fishes regardless of where or how he or she does it should feel some sort of kinship. Many of those who are frequently ridiculed on this site could become advocates and supporters of trout and their habitat needs if only given a chance. If this is not the case, then we are truly destined to see trout and for that matter fly fishing a distant memory.

Posted on: 2009/5/5 22:04


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2006/9/15 9:32
From Hershey, PA
Posts: 25
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I've been a member of this forum for a long time. I rarely post or reply because there are a small number of members who want to criticize anything. Just because someone can afford to fish Harpster's section of Spruce Creek, travel to Montana or Colorado to fish, or hire a guide in the Florida Keys doesn't give anyone the right to sarcastically comment on their situation. If you can't afford it or don't want to spend the money, that's fine but why jump all over someone else just because they do. I've seen criticism concerning purchasing $500.00 fly rods or $300.00 vises. To each his own. Live and let live. I guess an open forum is interpreted by some as a place to rant and criticize. How unfortunate!!!!!

Posted on: 2009/5/6 12:13


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
Posts: 19932
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I found another forum for those of you that are afraid of criticism and debate: http://www.mlparena.com/Forums.html

Also, who has ever criticized anyone for chartering a boat or hiring a guide? Privatized streams are wholly different, and it's been expressed clearly.

Posted on: 2009/5/6 12:17


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2007/4/25 10:02
Posts: 5783
Offline
FF1955-

There are lots of people that frequent here that have the same feelings you do.

They just don't post either- maybe if they did it might change things.

Like I said I don't feel the least bit bad about it. I fished all over as many people on here have- they probably would just feel like their bragging or just don't like sharing.

Me- I like hearing about people's trips etc... If people are jealous or upset- that's their own problem.

I fish with Sage's and Winston's because I enjoy them and so do most of my friends.

Posted on: 2009/5/6 12:35
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I flyfish because I enjoy it.


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
Posts: 13355
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I'll start off by saying nice report. The original poster and I may or may not disagree on a few issues, but I never let those disagreements get personal. I hope he feels free to keep posting and I enjoyed the report.

As for morality of posting land. I respect the legal right of a landowner to post his/her land. But legal and moral considerations are slightly different in my book.

Whether or not its moral to post land, to me, is all about the intent. If the intent is to protect oneself or one's property, there's nothing wrong with that. For instance litter or property damage situations. However, the part that gets lost is exactly what is one's property? It is the land for sure, and the streambottom if and only if the stream is non-navigable. The water itself (assuming flowing water), and any wildlife in the water or on land is public property. If the intent of the posting is to exclude the public from that resource for personal benefit (recreational or monetary), then that is immoral IMO, even if its not always illegal. If its the monetary factor, then its really a business who's model is to make money by charging people to access what is rightfully theirs. Contributing to that business is also immoral.

I know its awfully difficult to legislate intent, especially when there can be multiple intents, and I don't have a legal answer to solve the issue. But as JayL said, thats the law of the universe, don't be a douche....

Posted on: 2009/5/6 14:37


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2008/9/12 12:41
Posts: 726
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I understand what you are saying but I’m not aware of any law or any other legal instrument that classifies the water and fish in a stream as, “public property.” (I could be wrong.)

If I buy a piece of property on a non-navigable stream and own the streambed, it certainly seems that while I may not “own” the fish and flowing water, I certainly have the exclusive right to the fish that reside on my property. I don’t believe I can stop someone from floating through my property on a canoe but I certainly believe I could stop them from floating through with a fishing line in the water. And if I decide to post the land and then charge people $250 per day to fish the water, I don’t see how that is immoral – it’s a business – I’m paying property taxes on this land, the fish aren’t paying me rent for living on my stream bottom so it’s mine to do with it as I wish.

The bottom line is if people are willing to pay why should I stop?

BTW, I do agree that it totally sucks when someone buys property surrounding a stream, posts it and turns it into a pay-to-fish section. But as long as people are willing to join private clubs and pay landowners, this will continue. If you look at England, unfortunately almost all the prime waters are pay-to-fish and it isn’t cheap! All the chalkstone streams are privatized and membership in the clubs is very exclusive and exclusionary. We actually have it pretty damn good over here compare to England and other places in Europe.

Posted on: 2009/5/6 15:02


Re: Spruce Creek 5/1/09-5/3/09 Wayne's Private Section

Joined:
2006/9/10 21:53
From Greensburg, PA
Posts: 13623
Offline
I had a nice post all done up and ready to submit when I lost the server...well crap.

Anyway, the guy came back and defended his post...good. He wasn't pissed. He understood the points of view and explained his own.

Sometimes you have to treat posts from people who registered "today" like something you find in the woods. Poke it with a stick...see if its for real or if its just a troll. If its a troll they usually don't come back.

If you can't express your opinion on a bulletin board, then pack it up and turn it off. Or go to the one that Jay suggested. We get together every year and all are invited. No internet muscles here...we all meet and drink and fish face to face eventually.

Jam on...

Posted on: 2009/5/6 15:38



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