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Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
Posts: 12923
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sight-nymph,

All that water thats taken out of wells for use doesn't just vanish. It goes back into the system. Most cities just discharge it to the stream. I believe, but am not sure, that in State College its used for spray irrigation, at a rate that allows it to absorb into the ground instead of run off. So its taken from wells, used, treated, and then put back into the groundwater system. It all ends up in Spring Creek regardless.

You're not going to see effect the "average" flow rates unless the gauge is between where its taken and where it finds its way back to the stream. Houserville gauge, maybe. But I'm pretty sure the Axeman gauge would include the springs carrying what once was the sewage, so as much is being added as taken away in the long run. It will change the timing. Water use is higher at some times of day than others, but I would assume it gets back to the stream at a relatively constant rate. You do in fact see daily "blips" in the flow rate on Spring Creek on the Axeman gauge, which is likely related to water use in the borough as well as university.

http://waterdata.usgs.gov/nwis/uv?01546500

You can even go as far as seeing morning and evening peaks, and daytime lulls (when people are at work). And on weekends, the morning peak isn't as strong.

Where you'll see the biggest difference is in run-off rates. A heavy rain will result in some runoff regardless of whether its forest or city. But more definitely soaks in in the forest. In city areas, very little soaks in to become part of the water table, most of it flows directly into storm drains. i.e. the stream will be a lot higher in high water periods, and lower in low water periods. Thats not good for a stream. The median may change but the average will stay the same. The only thing that effects the average is the amount of rainfall, since every drop flows downstream sometime.

As far as Paradise, I'm talking right at the Paradise, not other areas. But yeah, its pretty artificial, the stream channel itself has been altered numerous times throughout history. I'm not talking just about the obvious wing dams. Looking at some old pictures of the place, there's much you wouldn't recognize.

Posted on: 2010/6/23 18:45


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2007/3/26 22:22
Posts: 1348
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With the abuse that creek has taken, it's amazing that it still hold fish. The hatches have been sloooowly getting better over the last 20-25 yrs. I would have love to see it before the chemical spills and sewage discharges.

Posted on: 2010/6/23 18:51


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
Posts: 19932
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I would imagine it was similar to penns hatch-wise.

Posted on: 2010/6/23 18:52


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

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2007/3/26 22:22
Posts: 1348
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I remember reading that SC had an awesome drake hatch. Another one that blows my mind is Big Spring. Back in the 50's that was supposed to have some sick hatches. Read some where that it gave up a fish over 12 or 15 lbs during an olive hatch back in the day.

Posted on: 2010/6/23 19:33


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2009/10/25 12:34
From The Hilton
Posts: 1692
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12 or 15lb fish on an olive would make me weep like high school girl that just got her heart broke!

Posted on: 2010/6/23 19:38
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Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

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2009/10/25 12:34
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Quote:

jayL wrote:
I would imagine it was similar to penns hatch-wise.


Or similar to the Delaware!

Posted on: 2010/6/23 19:39
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Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
Posts: 12923
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Probably not quite the diversity of Penns, which has I don't know how many hundred species of mayflies. But yeah, the big hatches were probably similar. I'd expect it had very strong MB and GD hatches to add the sulfurs, BWO's, and tricos of today. Not sure if it was ever strong in the grannoms, stones, slate drakes, and the like, but I don't know that it wasn't either.

Posted on: 2010/6/23 19:40


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2009/8/19 17:22
Posts: 1289
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a friend of mine that is a retired fly shop owner and now works part time at a local sporting goods store told me he fished spring creek before the degradation and he said most people wore face nets to fish because the bugs were so bad , he also said many nights he had to run his windshield wipers to clear the sulfurs off the windshield driving home on spring creek road , he has a picture of a 29 " brown he caught when there used to be a island below the paradise ,

Posted on: 2010/6/23 20:09


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2006/9/10 16:07
From Pine Grove
Posts: 2390
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Quote:

MattBoyer wrote:
Quote:

afishinado wrote:

Susquehanna salmon = shad?

I've seen this reference regarding Swatara Creek, and that is the best I can figure out.
Quote:

Perch-Pike = walleye?


According to "Fishing with Ray Bergman", this is correct.

Boyer


Haha, I just read another chapter in "Fishing with Ray" and he calls Walleye Susquehanna Salmon. Same answer, different region, I guess.

Boyer

Posted on: 2010/6/24 17:57


Re: Spot Burning...Gim me a break

Joined:
2009/10/15 12:02
From Dispositionally, one mile south of Lake LeBoeuf
Posts: 530
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>>Haha, I just read another chapter in "Fishing with Ray" and he calls Walleye Susquehanna Salmon. Same answer, different region, I guess.>>

There was an old guy who worked in the copper mill in Erie with my Dad back in the 40's and 50's. He was originally from around Selinsgrove. He always referred to walleye as "Susquehanna Salmon".

Posted on: 2010/6/24 18:33



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