Panfish invading a trout stream!

[streamerguy]

My brother and I decided to head out to a little stream today which usually fishes well after a good rain. Well, it didn't disappoint us. It fished REALLY good today, but most of our catch consisted of bluegills, pumpkinseeds, green sunfish, crappie, and even a little bass!! Don't know what's up. Other than today I think I caught a total of one panfish(a green sunfish if I remember correctly) total there, and today they were in just about every nice sized hole from about where we started to where we ended which was a total of 2 miles. Maybe a pond flooded over in the headwaters? Who knows. Last time I fished it was earlier this summer and there were no signs of any panfish then.

Despite the tons of small panfish, the trout are doing fine. The stream was a lot lower and clearer than I was hoping for, but we made it work. Caught a bunch(mostly dinks like the second pic, but some decent ones too) and lost/missed/spooked just as many including ones that would be happy to eat some of the smaller sunfish. Water temp was 58.

Just an odd day today...

 

[springer1]

I love mixed day like that !

 

[PatrickC]

I was there in the rain yesterday. It hasn't exactly been invaded. Those fish showed up after the bad floods this Summer. There are hybrid sunfish in the mix as well. They are most certainly washed down from a pond upstream during the flood. We've been tossing them out all Summer.

The good news: I had a buddy there a couple of weeks ago that saw a brown trout swimming up the middle of a pool with a 4" blue gill in his mouth.

Now, for the funny story. When we got there yesterday 4 guys were getting in a car. They had fly gear....what appeared to be 6wt rods. I was cracking up. That creek requires 3wt rods maximum. Leave the steelhead gear at home ;-)

We had an awesome day. About 2:30 yesterday afternoon the flows and stain came up and it was game-on! It was a fantastic afternoon. Here are a couple we caught.

 

[streamerguy]

That's what I figured with the floods. Just looking at Google maps there appears to be some ponds up in the headwaters, but the water had to have been really high for those fish to escape, and be as spread out as they are. At least the trout have a nice buffet for a while! Those are some nice fish, and that's exactly why I like to fish it after a really good rain. I guess I was just a little late today.

 

[PatrickC]

I think the upside to the bluegill etc. is that it is going to push some of those 16-18" fish into the 20"+ class. When those fish slow down over the Winter, the browns are going to feast even more. We'll see. Yesterday I caught my 9th different 16"+ fish on the creek. Didn't catch any of my old friends though.

Did a little stream maintenance along the way as well. Just removed some sticks and branches from a few of the major pools.

They should really start to intensify in color here pretty soon. Not much yet, but within the next few weeks they should really get pretty. I always enjoy hanging with my little butter belly buddies this type of year.

 

[streamerguy]

It would be interesting to see if the bigger fish take advantage of the new food source. I haven't caught or seen any legit 20 inchers out of there yet, but there's certainly enough habitat and now plenty of additional food for them. Even if they don't grow any longer, at least they'll be strong, fat fish!

I know it's still pretty early yet, but I kept an eye out for any early spawners. They will definitely start to color up here soon.

 

[PatrickC]

I don't usually see these fish spawn until early November. I usually take a walk around the stream that time a year and just take photographs. It's pretty cool to see.

 

[Fishidiot]

Interesting.
Most small, freestone trout creeks in my neck of the woods have transient summer/early fall populations of sunfish and bass. Some years they are extremely thick and other years less so, but they're always there. Almost all of them vacate the creeks after first frost to return the following summer.
My guess would be that the sunnies in this creek will be gone within the next month - I doubt that they're still going to be there at trout spawning time......but yuh never know. If you guys hit this creek later this year, it would be interesting to hear if you're still seeing so many WW fishes.

 

[PatrickC]

You are correct sir. There have always been a few green sunfish in the deep pools. An occasional dink SMB down low. This year the pools were stuffed with bluegill, hybrid blue gill, huge crappie, smb and lmb. Highly improbable if not impossible for those fish to get past the lower falls to the upper pools.

 

[streamerguy]

Most small, freestone trout creeks in my neck of the woods have transient summer/early fall populations of sunfish and bass. Some years they are extremely thick and other years less so, but they're always there.

Interesting. About a month ago I fished a different wild trout stream and came across a bunch of sunfish. Not a lot, just a couple in the slow pools. It's a good stream for both wild and stocked trout but I wasn't really expecting to see sunnies. Makes me wonder what other streams they're in.

 

[brain]

We've been tossing them out all Summer.

as in tossing them out of creek when caught?

 

[boychick]

Looks like a fun little excursion. Did you fish any dry flies? Interesting about the sunfish/bass. I wonder if they may have come up stream seeking refuge from the heavy flow after the rain?

 

[MattBoyer]

streamerguy wrote:

Most small, freestone trout creeks in my neck of the woods have transient summer/early fall populations of sunfish and bass. Some years they are extremely thick and other years less so, but they're always there.

Interesting. About a month ago I fished a different wild trout stream and came across a bunch of sunfish. Not a lot, just a couple in the slow pools. It's a good stream for both wild and stocked trout but I wasn't really expecting to see sunnies. Makes me wonder what other streams they're in.

They can get annoying in the summer in Clark's above the dam, that's for sure.

Boyer

 

[Squaretail]

Clarks is what came to my mind as well, only below the dam.

Those fish showed up after the bad floods this Summer.

Multiple times after floods I've seen this on Clarks.

I think the upside to the bluegill etc. is that it is going to push some of those 16-18" fish into the 20"+ class.

I never figured trout to be much of a threat to sunfish considering the size of the trouts mouths, until I watched two attack one and litterally tear it in half on Clarks.
What a way to go. It was so savage I remember feeling a hint of remorse for the little feller.

 

[PatrickC]

Brown trout don't care. It just takes what it wants... :-D

 

[dryflyguy]

Streamerguy -

If this is the same stream where I met you briefly earlier this summer - biker fish and I caught several sunfish that day there also.
Doesn't surprise me. Flooding has impacted that stream a lot - a few of my favorite holes where drastically changed, or not even there any more.

 

[FarmerDave]

PatrickC wrote:

Now, for the funny story. When we got there yesterday 4 guys were getting in a car. They had fly gear....what appeared to be 6wt rods. I was cracking up. That creek requires 3wt rods maximum. Leave the steelhead gear at home ;-)

I don't think that is funny at all except for your choice of the word "requires." I believe what is required is what you have.

BTW, a lot of us old timers would find it funny that anyone would think a 3wt or smaller is required.

 

[Swattie87]

Although I've never fished it, I'm pretty sure I know what stream is being discussed here and its general topography. In this case, I think it's more likely the Sunfish and LMB are escapees from ponds or some other type of impoundment in the watershed, upstream from the mouth a ways. It's unlikey (if not impossible?) these fish navigated their way upstream from the larger receiving stream.

I've seen this on a few wild Trout streams in my area too, generally after flooding events. The fish that escape or are washed out of their pond/impoundment are generally pretty small and don't fare too well in the small stream environment. Sure, a few will figure it out and adapt to the current and the drop in Summer water temperature, but most will just continue to vacate downstream, or become food for the stream's resident fish.

Not sure if PatrickC was indicating they were banking the WW fish or not, but in either case, nature will sort this out pretty quickly. Any stream that holds a healthy population of wild Brown Trout, as I'm certain this one does, will not be suitable for growing and supporting Sunfish and LMB for an extended period of time. The water will not get warm enough, for long enough of a duration in the Summer to allow them to grow properly. In addition, this is a pretty steep stream...Sunfish and LMB are generally speaking not very fond of current, and will avoid it if at all possible. They'll do ok in the pools, but this is where the big Browns generally live and big Browns in my experience don't like to share their pool with anything that is small enough for them to eat. Eventually (over a couple of years) the cold or cool water species will win out and effectively eliminate the WW fish. You may end up with a couple of rogue fish that grow big enough to make it in the stream, but for the most part the WW fish will just disappear. For now, I'd just look at them as additional forage for the Browns. You probably will see some of the better fish in this stream (mid teens from what I've gathered in this thread and others) turn into upper teens fish for a couple of years thanks to the influx of "big fish" food.

 

[PatrickC]

FarmerDave wrote:

I don't think that is funny at all except for your choice of the word "requires." I believe what is required is what you have.

BTW, a lot of us old timers would find it funny that anyone would think a 3wt or smaller is required.

If I offended you, you certainly have my apologies.

 

[PatrickC]

Swattie87 wrote:
You probably will see some of the better fish in this stream (mid teens from what I've gathered in this thread and others) turn into upper teens fish for a couple of years thanks to the influx of "big fish" food.

I agree. I want to see a 20"+ from this creek. 19" is the largest I have seen. Hopefully this pushes them a little further. The good news is that the fish are always fat and healthy. And they will continue to be that way.