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Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2009/11/4 22:06
Posts: 735
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didn't see # 74 before my post

i see no owing of any apologies
i voiced my opinion of a practice i don't agree with
i made no personal attack... rather commented on the practice as being a "#oops# move"

i understand if that doesn't fit into the perpetual HJs that are given on this board...

Posted on: 2009/12/21 12:36


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
Posts: 19931
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lol. keyboard commando.

It's only repetitive when you're unable to understand what people are saying. Maybe someone can help you with that, but I'm not a teacher.

Not participating != not agreeing. That's step one. Someone else can take it from here.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 12:37


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2009/11/4 22:06
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never said was quiting...

- hes your friend... so you won't disagree
- there is a fundamental difference between people who will and won't poke fish with a stick

Posted on: 2009/12/21 12:42


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2006/9/9 8:53
From York
Posts: 515
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It's been just a couple days--I was reading a book with some of Jim Teeny's steelhead strategies. He talks of "rocking" fish and he does admit it is somewhat controversial. He sometimes throws rocks to move steelhead to a different lie. If other anglers are present he asks them if they mind--so he states in his book. Hey, everyones got their own thing--whatever. If somone chased fish out of a hole I was fishing I'd be somewhat upset. Now on the other hand if someone "sticked", "rocked" or "waded" some steelhead into my hole--well then, after a six hour drive............

Posted on: 2009/12/21 12:43


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
Posts: 19931
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Quote:

Ramcatt wrote:
never said was quiting...


Huh?

And I have disagreed with Ryan and many of my other friends before. I am in an argument of some sort all of the time. I enjoy it.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 12:54


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2008/1/21 13:28
From South Central PA
Posts: 832
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I was wondering what was keeping this thread alive.

I've never fished steelhead at Erie or anywhere else so this herding concept is new to me.

What I find interesting is that the steelhead are so willing to take after being "herded." Can you imagine herding a wild brown in Penns?

So with Steelhead not only can you move these fish, they apparently can become more aggressive and more likely to take. Probably common knowledge to experienced steelheaders but it's new to me.

If there are few or no other anglers around, is this herding or "exciting" by throwing rocks fairly common on the PA Erie tribs?

Posted on: 2009/12/21 13:39


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2009/11/4 22:06
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the fish are not willing to take after being herded...

the lies that the are poked out of are usually the only safe spots in the streams... once force out they are in gin clear bath tubs...

"anglers" stand over top of these fish an repeatedly drift egg patterns...

it not like there is an aggressive take... they are force fed, flossed, or foul hooked

Posted on: 2009/12/21 14:05


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2006/9/9 17:18
From lancaster county
Posts: 6446
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I heard fish all the time with a 7'6" stick

Posted on: 2009/12/21 14:16
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Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

Joined:
2009/7/22 15:53
From The Beaver
Posts: 221
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Quote:

salvelinusfontinalis wrote:
I heard fish all the time with a 7'6" stick


Sal this is a serious conversation...there is no need to belittle us all with your #oops# size.

Seriously...if Ryan was doing this to catch fish and let them flop around on the ground until dead then I could see the uproar but he is catch and release I doubt it caused any harm or did this with a malicious intent.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 14:30


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

Joined:
2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
Posts: 13453
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Ramcatt,

Where do you get this information?

1. Aggressive, feeding takes are not unusual at all at Erie. It's kind of weird how those fish turn on and off so quickly, and the odd things that turn them on. But when they're turned on, they definitely feed.

2. Herding is a fairly well known technique, and it can often make the steelhead more aggressive. You can debate whether the aggressiveness is anger or the desire to feed. But there's little question that in some situations it can make a true take more likely, in some cases they actually chase it.

It's not the same situation as regular trout. These are large migratory fish in small streams, they often move a mile or more overnight, and they never really get comfortable in any holding water. They also see people wading through day after day and just get used to it, just like deer become less spooky in more urban environments.

When they get inactive, things do get tough. Some people search all day for "active" fish and either succeed or they don't. Some resort to foul-hooking, and thats looked down upon by everyone. "Herding" is a totally different approach to try and get them moving and active, and apparantly it occasionally works. It's not good form if other anglers are around, but I have no issue with it as long as other anglers aren't in play and the angling part of it is to get the fish to intentionally take an offering.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 14:52


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2009/6/3 22:34
Posts: 149
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I vote we start a new thread for the Erie Stream Report. Btw, I was one of the guys pushing the fish into a fishable zone. For the record, I take offense to the statement that was made by the newcomer to the board. If you don't like what you see go somewhere else with your negativity. We caused no damage and broke no laws. We simply pushed the fish to a more accessible location. If I could do that with trout then I would gladly do it. I fish for the joy of it and it is your negativity that ruins it for some people. When I start breaking laws then you can say something to me, until then go cry somewhere else.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 15:34


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2009/11/4 22:06
Posts: 735
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pcray-
they are inbread hatchery lake run trout... but a less trouty than normal holdovers
"herding" is not as common as you make it out to be and it doesn't "turn on" fish... it spooks them
they winter in pools before going to gravel in spring

yes they eat
and will even take a swung fly
but when a pod is sitting in a bath tub and you put an egg pattern infront of of the same fish 25 times for an eat on 26... i really wouldn't call that an aggressive take


PA has created an amusement park of lake run bows
in no other place would someone think of "herding" fish


goove
i stand by what i said
the last thing people on upper elk should be doing is poking fish with sticks and chasing them upstream... save that for the circus
learn how to fish and adapt to situations... rather than changing situations to fit you

Posted on: 2009/12/21 15:52


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

Joined:
2008/5/5 11:06
From King Of Prussia, Pa
Posts: 1195
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Quote:

afishinado wrote:
I’m not really appalled by it, but I wouldn’t do it. It’s a lot like some other practices such as the San Juan shuffle, stoning the pool, or chumming (where legal). It may help you catch fish, but it’s not my cup of tea.



Afish,

Whats the "san juan shuffle"?

Posted on: 2009/12/21 16:33


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

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2009/1/7 12:19
From Glenmoore PA
Posts: 548
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JasonS,

Im pretty sure its shuffling your feet, in hopes that you stir the pot so to speak putting aqautic worms, nymphs and such in the drift. This usually induces feeding downstream of this. Sort of a technique to make inactvie fish active. Someone correct me if Im wrong.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 17:03


Re: Elk Creek, Erie County PA 12/5/2009

Joined:
2006/9/10 21:53
From Greensburg, PA
Posts: 13624
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Isn't there a forum where he could rag on about outright herding, lifting and snagging of steelhead. Its kind of a #oops# bag move to keep harping on this in the stream reports section.

Posted on: 2009/12/21 17:11



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