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Re: Striped bass stocks over fished
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Dave_W wrote:
Quote:

springer1 wrote:
Quote:
There is to much greed involved when it comes to this fish their will be no regulation agreed upon that will help the fish recover. And from what I can tell is that the only reg that helped the fish recover was the closure. So they will attempt to add another stricter reg change like they have been doing for the past ten years

I think you're right, I hope not but .........


I'm a bit more optimistic.

It should be remembered that what we're seeing right now is not a wholesale and catastrophic population collapse as occurred in the late 70s-early 80s in which there were multiple poor years of YOY. What we're dealing with here is over harvest of older adults. An 80s style moratorium isn't needed and isn't going to happen. Instead, some progressive regulations that move the needle in the right direction are what is needed. To begin with, some basic education of anglers about the time it takes to grow a large SB (a 40" bass is about 13 years old), combined with stricter harvest limits on big fish are what is needed. Reduction of menhaden harvest would also help as well.

The SB population has not collapsed. Recent YOY numbers over the last decade are average or better and there are plenty of fish out there. Folks just need to release the big females. Whether VA adopts the closed spring trophy season remains to be seen (I hope they do) but it would not surprise me if such measures are approved.

Smaller, incremental steps in the right direction are the answer in situations like this.


Education of anglers is a difficult thing when the lure (no pun intended) of catching a lot of big fish is put before many anglers.

Here is an example of an ad for just one party boat for striper fishing:

Down Deep Sportfishing Striper (Striped Bass) Fishing NJ Charters
New Jersey is known for some of the finest striped bass fishing on the East Coast. In fact, the World Record Striped Bass of 78 lbs 8oz. was caught right here at the Jersey Shore! Striper fishing in New Jersey is an angler's dream! Many Striped Bass enthusiasts search a lifetime for a trophy Striper. Spring fishing has provided hot action on big fish up to 50lbs. It's not uncommon to hook up with a 30+ lb. trophy Striped Bass in NJ, many trips providing limit catches while catch and releasing over 50 fish on one charter.



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Posted on: 4/10 9:36


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Many have asked me about my thoughts on a moratorium? I see no other realistic path for us. Considering the state of the fishery but more importantly how it’s been managed. Every regulation change that has been made was always a day late a dollar short. We all have skin in this game. The time has come to treat this irreplaceable resource like it belongs to everyone.

Posted on: 4/10 15:13


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Dave,
In my view, you are absolutely correct (even your menhaden comment). To add one other positive, there are two big year classes out there that have yet to even enter the fishery, although one will do so this year during Pa's two month slot fishery, occurring this month and next, and Delaware's summer slot fishery.

Even in Pa's slot limit case, for example, the regs allow room for more conservative management by simply tightening the slot a little more, reducing the creel limit, shortening the season, requiring circle hook usage by bait anglers, and, although never discussed before, eliminating live-lining, a technique that in my view can easily lead to "gut-hooking" of big fish during the season that is technically closed for those fish.

As an aside, but definitely related, live lining of eels anywhere, coastal or otherwise, is something that I have felt should be eliminated years ago and I stated as much when I was on the ASMFC American Eel Technical Committee. There is no need to use eels to catch stripers when there are so many alternative techniques available and eels, in their own right, are and have been a distressed population.

As for angler desires when it comes to the size fish they would like to harvest vs catch, that is something that to my knowledge has never been assessed along the coast or in tribs. Perhaps anglers would like to keep some smaller, school-size fish to eat, but catch more larger fish, even if most or all would need to be released. Even if that were not what anglers preferred under normal circumstances, they might be more willing to do so with the knowledge of the overfishing/overfished situation. While serving on the ASMFC Striped Bass Technical Committee I also suggested this angler preference survey once, but it was never taken up. Such info would, in my view, have been helpful at this juncture particularly when formulating new regs, if that is the route that is taken.

As Afish mentions below, however, the C&R mortality is already higher than the harvest mortality, so that is a disconcerting situation that also needs to be addressed. That could start to be addressed through fishing technique regulations and seasonal restrictions. For instance, delayed mortality is typically higher in some fisheries when water temps are warmer.

Finally, you should be aware if you weren't before that Pa has had a seat on the ASMFC Atlantic Menhaden Board in very recent years. Pa applied and was accepted based on the number of Menhaden that were seasonally seen for years in the Delaware Estuary in the Philly/Chester area. On occasion they would even be seen as early in the year as early May when Pa was conducting the striped bass spawning stock survey, but they were generally reliably present during the summer months. By being on the Board, Pa's vote counts as much as the votes of the "big player states," which I suspect could be a little irritating, given Pa's frequent conservative stance on coastal fisheries issues.

As an aside, this should again serve to remind those on this message board that there is a lot more to PFBC fisheries management concerns and fisheries conservation than just trout and their license fees help to support those efforts.

Posted on: 4/11 8:52

Edited by Mike on 2019/4/11 9:16:45
Edited by Mike on 2019/4/11 9:24:35
Edited by Mike on 2019/4/11 9:28:03
Edited by Mike on 2019/4/11 9:32:53


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished
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Quote:

Mike wrote:
Dave,
In my view, you are absolutely correct. To add one other positive, there are two big year classes out there that have yet to even enter the fishery, although one will do so this year during Pa's two month slot fishery, occurring this month and next, and Delaware's summer slot fishery.

Even in Pa's slot limit case, for example, the regs allow room for more conservative management by simply tightening the slot a little more, reducing the creel limit, shortening the season, requiring circle hook usage by bait anglers, and, although never discussed before, eliminating live-lining, a technique that in my view can easily lead to "gut-hooking" of big fish during the season that is technically closed for those fish.

As an aside, but definitely related, live lining of eels anywhere, coastal or otherwise, is something that I have felt should be eliminated years ago and I stated as much when I was on the ASMFC American Eel Technical Committee. There is no need to use eels to catch stripers when there are so many alternative techniques available and eels, in their own right, are and have been a distressed population.

As for angler desires when it comes to the size fish they would like to harvest vs catch, that is something that to my knowledge has never been assessed along the coast or in tribs. Perhaps anglers would like to keep some smaller, school-size fish to eat, but catch more larger fish, even if most or all would need to be released. Even if that were not what anglers preferred under normal circumstances, they might be more willing to do so with the knowledge of the overfishing/overfished situation. While serving on the ASMFC Striped Bass Technical Committee I also suggested this angler preference survey once, but it was never taken up. Such info would, in my view, have been helpful at this juncture particularly when formulating new regs, if that is the route that is taken.



The one thing that really opened my eyes and is very disconcerting is the fact that C&R mortality accounts for nearly half (48%) of the amount of stripers removed from the population. This percentage is higher than commercial or recreational harvest. Therefore stricter harvest regulations will have very little effect on the overall population and are actually likely to increase the C&R mortality. I really don't have any answer.


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Posted on: 4/11 9:15

Edited by afishinado on 2019/4/12 7:07:41


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished
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Posted on: 4/12 11:36


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished
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Just to clarify - unless I'm missing something - this link above is regarding the same proposal that Fredrick linked to earlier up this thread.

Again, in summary, VA has proposed cancelling their spring striped bass season for trophy fish. It should be emphasized that this is not complete closure of SB recreational harvest - just the spring trophy season. As I said before, I hope this passes and Maryland considers doing the same thing as we need a reduction of SB harvest, especially big fish.

I am not sure if adoption of this regulation would prohibit C&R targeting of big springtime SB as, even with C&R, there is high mortality.

Posted on: 4/12 15:03


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Virginia, Massachusetts and Connecticut have all sent letters to request more protection for striped bas

https://saltwaterguidesassociation.com ... position-on-striped-bass/

Posted on: 4/18 19:47


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Governor Cuomo just signed a bill to protect bunker

http://outdoortom.com/2019/04/5488/

Posted on: 4/19 2:15


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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I've seen this movie before. I can remember in college, when kids who grew up on the Cape would beg me to take them landlocked striper fishing on Smith Mountain Lake, because they had only heard about catching stripers after the big crash in the 1980s. They need to protect the bunker and the stripers (and maybe take a chunk out of the seal population) if they want to save the fishery.

Posted on: 4/21 9:19


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Posted on: 4/24 23:04


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished
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Fredrick wrote:
It’s official Va cancelled trophy season


Good news and a step in the right direction.

Thanks for keeping us informed on this Fredrick.

Posted on: 4/25 10:08


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Popular articles are informative, but if you really want to get more in depth info and stay on top of the entire coastal/bays/regulation change options, then if you are up to the task put on your thinking caps because this will not be a "sound bite" and review this:

http://www.asmfc.org/home/2019-spring-meeting

Scroll down to Atlantic Striped Bass Management Board - review the Striped Bass Board's agenda for next week's (Tuesday) meeting, click on Assessment if you want to review the stock assessment.
-click on Supplemental if you want to review the Technical Committee's report, which discusses among other things the possible new quota, regulation changes, such as a 35 inch limit along the coast, rationale, etc.
If you go to the ASMFC calendar of events and click on the striper meeting for Tuesday you will see how to hook up to the webinar and how to join the conference call to listen to the meeting live.

Posted on: 4/25 13:40


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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Good stuff mike http://www.asmfc.org/files/Meetings/2 ... ripedBassSupplemental.pdf


Results
Results for the regional size limit analyses are shown in Table 2. In the ocean (which includes
ocean waters from Maine – North Carolina and non-Chesapeake Bay inland waters like
Delaware Bay and Long Island Sound), the current minimum size limit is 28 inches. In order to
reduce total removals by 17%, the size limit would need to be increased to 35 inches.
This
analysis assumed that current non-compliant harvest (harvest of fish smaller than the current
size limit) would still occur. As with any increase in minimum size, dead releases would be
expected to increase as anglers would have to release fish that were no longer of legal size
Under the 35 inch size limit, dead releases are expected to increase by 3% in the ocean. This
increase is more than offset by the reduction in harvested fish.
A 17% reduction is estimated if Maryland raised the minimum size limit from 19 inches for the
summer/fall season to 21 inches. In Virginia, an 18% reduction is estimated if the 20 inch
minimum size limit is increased to 22 inches. Under these scenarios, dead releases are expected
to increase by 4.3% for Maryland and 3.5% for Virginia, but again, the increase is offset by the
reduction in harvest.

Posted on: 4/25 14:25


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished

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If ASMFC ultimately goes with a mimimum length limit, 35 inches is a practical number, even if it was generated by a modeling effort through the Striped Bass Technical Committee. On occasion I have looked at the length distribution of catches throughout the coast and despite all that you hear about trophy fish being caught, the number of fish caught over 35 inches long is a small percentage. Likewise for our annual Delaware Estuary Spawning Stock Electrofishing Survey, which we started in 1994. Low numbers of stripers are captured that are over 35 inches long. Just as on the coast, fish abundance tails off substantially beyond 35 inches, which is why I checked the coastal data to see if we were missing a group of larger fish in our sampling.

Nevertheless, as I may have stated earlier in this thread, I would hope that at some point they look at a maximum size limit. There may be reluctance to do that, however, because of the belief that anglers absolutely want to harvest trophy fish or because there would be strong concerns about delayed C&R mortality. Let's be honest; these aren't trout and some C&R anglers have trouble properly handling fish as small as trout during their release or during the "requisite" photo sessions. Getting large stripers off of a hook and back into the water without dropping them or putting them through a torturous hook removal session, let alone safely ( for the fish) taking a pic, is a real challenge. And then there are the careless (I normally use a stronger word) who want to hold them vertically by the opercle or jaw, adding to the damage ( internal organs in the former, gills and cartillage in the latter). Stay tuned. Next week's meeting will be interesting.

Posted on: 4/26 8:59


Re: Striped bass stocks over fished
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Mike wrote:
If ASMFC ultimately goes with a mimimum length limit, 35 inches is a practical number, even if it was generated by a modeling effort through the Striped Bass Technical Committee. I have looked pretty closely at the length distribution of catches throughout the coast at times and despite all that you hear about trophy fish being caught, the number of fish caught over 35 inches long is a small percentage. Likewise for our annual Delaware Estuary Spawning Stock Electrofishing Survey, which we started in 1994. Low numbers of stripers are captured that are over 35 inches long. Just as on the coast, fish abundance tails off substantially beyond 35 inches.

Nevertheless, as I may have stated earlier in this thread, I would hope that at some point they look at a maximum size limit. There may be reluctance to do that, however, because of the belief that anglers absolutely want to harvest trophy fish or because there would be strong concerns about delayed C&R mortality. Let's be honest; these aren't trout and some C&R anglers have trouble properly handling fish as small as trout during their release or during the "requisite" photo sessions. Getting large stripers off of a hook and back into the water without dropping them or putting them through a torturous hook removal session, let alone safely ( for the fish) taking a pic, is a real challenge. And then there are the careless (I normally use a stronger word) who want to hold them vertically by the opercle or jaw, adding to the damage ( internal organs in the former, gills and cartillage in the latter).


No doubt the conundrum is increasing harvest restrictions for size or numbers of fish will have limited effect on the population since mortality from C&R is by far causes the highest percentage of striper mortality > close to 50%. In fact more restrictive harvest rules will result in even more fish released to die from the things Mike describes above.

Posted on: 4/26 9:10



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