Register now on PaFlyFish.com! Login
HOME FORUM BLOG PHOTOS LINKS


Sponsors

Browsing this Thread:   1 Anonymous Users



« 1 (2) 3 4 5 ... 8 »


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline
I fish a spot that has both species and one species will be hot one day and the other the next . The fish are almost exactly the same with the exception that both parents guard the fry for snakeheads and Bowfin will bottom feed were snakeheads mostly eat live food . But in the areas they coexist there hasn’t been any noticeable changes to Bowfin populations that I have observed . For the most part I find snakeheads fill a niche that wasn’t there in most locations they seen to thrive in areas that are mainly occupied by carp.

Posted on: 2018/7/17 20:11


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline
Here is video three of Robert fields snakehead trip the video includes a Electro shocking with John Odenkirk

https://youtu.be/uUNCd9Vwxpc

Posted on: 2018/7/17 20:20


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2010/5/28 0:25
Posts: 691
Offline
Quote:

Fredrick wrote:
For you poopy
https://joebruceflyfishing.wordpress.com



If you were referring to me as "poopy", how imaginative.

Posted on: 2018/7/17 20:48


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline
Quote:

outsider wrote:
Quote:

Fredrick wrote:
For you poopy
https://joebruceflyfishing.wordpress.com



If you were referring to me as "poopy", how imaginative.
looks like I’m still amusing you but poopy knows who he is .

Posted on: 2018/7/17 20:51


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2010/5/28 0:25
Posts: 691
Offline
Then perhaps you will know who Frauderick is.

Posted on: 2018/7/17 21:01
_________________
I'm a sinner, finished my dinner, now I can go outside.


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline
Quote:

outsider wrote:
Then perhaps you will know who Frauderick is.


Sorry never met that person tell me more about them

Posted on: 2018/7/17 21:13


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2010/5/28 0:25
Posts: 691
Offline
Quote:

Fredrick wrote:
Quote:

outsider wrote:
Then perhaps you will know who Frauderick is.


Sorry never met that person tell me more about them


Am I going to tell you about a person singular or persons?

Posted on: 2018/7/17 21:22


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias
Moderator
Joined:
2016/1/24 14:30
From Gettysburg
Posts: 3383
Offline
This thread, unfortunately, has turned to trolling and name calling and is at risk of no longer serving any valuable purpose.

If it does not return to constructive discussion, it will be removed.
Thanks,
DW

Posted on: 2018/7/17 21:35

Edited by Dave_W on 2018/7/17 22:29:19


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline
poopy is me referring to poopdeck . Not sure why he thought I was referring to him .

Posted on: 2018/7/17 21:40

Edited by Fredrick on 2018/7/17 22:28:42


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2007/4/23 20:53
From Carlisle PA
Posts: 250
Offline
Dave, seems you are right. Seems as if Fredrick thinks the site belongs to him and he gets to decide who can post and what they can say. Wack this discussion!

Posted on: 2018/7/17 22:04


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline
Quote:

joebamboo wrote:
Dave, seems you are right. Seems as if Fredrick thinks the site belongs to him and he gets to decide who can post and what they can say. Wack this discussion!

I’m not sure what to say I started this thread for people to voice there opinions in a open discussion and it seems like I’m the one getting attacked . If anything it seems you are the one trying to censor people. A success thread is a norm for the warm water section of this forum it’s the WW equivalent to a stream report and I honor it as such . The thread turned into a debate on snakeheads and that was not my intention of starting the thread, so I started this one for people to discuss

Posted on: 2018/7/17 22:40


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/9/9 22:43
From Delaware Co.
Posts: 1034
Offline

Snakeheads- Love them or hate them
I feel like ranting… Snakeheads have been caught by hook and line for over fourteen years and the controversy still rages. They will kill our environment is the cry from some folks that only know what the media put out over 16 years ago and never bothered to do any new research into these fish, it isn’t new news, so the media has moved on and people are left with what they first remembered and believed.

The media only got one right…they are good table fare. They don’t walk on land, they aren’t going to eat your dogs & cats and grand moms don’t be alarmed, they aren’t going to eat your grand kids. They don’t spawn 5 times a year. They don’t eat everything in sight. They are somewhat shy and lazy.

Basically they are minnow eaters, primary banded killifish and bluegill. I have chased this great gamefish for pushing a decade and I can say I have not seen any change in the fishery. Matter of fact where bass and snakeheads coexist I have seen the bass seem to be larger. I guess this isn’t the snakehead eating the bass (Virginia has open over 1500 snakeheads and found only about 3% bass in their stomachs, BUT, I bet every bass has baby snakeheads in them). They have no hard fins so they are prey for all fish. Why do you think they lay so many eggs? Not many will survive.

I have always thought that most folks that fly the banner… “Kill the snakehead” and wants you to know it, has never caught one, for if they had they too would see what great battlers they are. Any fisherman that likes bass fishing surely will like the fight of a snakehead. Maybe not the bass tournament guys, they think they are going to eat all their beloved bass, which by the way was introduced and are not native. These guys feel the same way about chain pickerel which they believe don’t belong in THEIR waters. They don’t know that the pickerel is a native fish that once covered the whole east coast and all the way to the Mississippi. Maybe the introduction of the bass in their waters took a toll, because they aren’t everywhere anymore.

A few fishermen lose the full fighting aspect of snakehead by fishing with bait on the bottom, yes they will catch fish and that is alright, but these fish are one of the best top water fish around. The whole experience is visible, from the initial follow to the sound of the fish closing its jaw on the bait. Its music to my ears, can’t get enough of it.

Before I decided to go on this rant, I looked up the bowfin on Wikipedia. This fish is a close second to the snakehead in many ways and they have been around for 30,000,000 years and guess what, haven’t destroyed the environment.

More and more fishermen are touting the fishing quality of the snakehead and feel as strong as I do they are a worthy opponent. It has been taking time and we snakeheaders need to help educate folks that they aren’t the “frankenfish” that the media and uninformed believe or what they want you to believe without any scientific information. So the next time someone says…”Kill the snakehead” just ask them if they have ever caught one. You already know the answer, just walk away; they don’t know what we know.

IMG_00https://joebruceflyfishing.wordpress.com

Posted on: 2018/7/17 22:46


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/12/13 9:28
From Other side of the tracks
Posts: 5021
Offline
Quote:

salvelinusfontinalis wrote:
Obviously 2 different critters but by how much?

Bowfin are native to PA. Snakeheads are not.

Are the two similar breeders, similar in food consumption and similar in aggressive nature?
If so, while not good, they could displace the bowfin if they have an advantage but might not effect other fish to the degree people think.

I'm asking because I'm curious and have no clue, I'm not defending or advocating for snakeheads, just an honest question.

I also question if they would survive in a cold water creek like the letort. Anyone know if that's even possible?


The non-anecdotal stuff that Fredrick provided is accurate. I can't speak for the anecdotal because I haven't fished for either.

Both are very aggressive ambush predators.
Both can live in a variety of water conditions but seem to thrive in stagnant water because they can breath air. Little competition other than with each other.
Bowfin build nests and the male defends the brood. Both parents of Snakehead defend the brood in a ball.

There are many species of shakehead. I think a total of three have been introduced in the US. Definitely two. The ones we are talking about are Northern Snakehead which can be found in parts of Russia, China, and both Koreas. It gets very cold there.

I think the biggest advantage that snakehead have over bowfin would be reproduction rate. Whether or not this is enough to displace the bowfin is debatable.

Any questions?

P.S. I'm no expert, but info is available out there if people can get past their bias and look it up.

Posted on: 2018/7/18 7:53
_________________
Hank Patterson for President.



Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2013/12/8 21:26
From Granville
Posts: 1407
Offline
This is purely my opinion, but I don't see snakeheads having much of an effect on the majority of our waterways. I think that most of our rivers have more current than they prefer and so they would be found in the slack water areas. I don't think that they are going to our smallmouth populations. For those of you that are worried about trout being displaced, I really don't think the snakehad would be at home in trout streams. Trout waters are generally higher gradient, colder, with less areas of super slack water that is densley vegetated.

Posted on: 2018/7/18 8:14


Re: Snakehead Woes and bias

Joined:
2006/12/13 9:28
From Other side of the tracks
Posts: 5021
Offline
Quote:

Fredrick wrote:

Snakeheads- Love them or hate them

I feel like ranting… Snakeheads have been caught by hook and line for over fourteen years and the controversy still rages. They will kill our environment is the cry from some folks that only know what the media put out over 16 years ago and never bothered to do any new research into these fish, it isn’t new news, so the media has moved on and people are left with what they first remembered and believed.


I beg to differ in one point. It is clear to me that they can decimate other aquatic fauna in certain situations. I've fished in abandoned cranberry bogs in the pine barons where chain pickerel have wiped out nearly everything else and survive by cannibalism. I'd be foolish to thing snakehead couldn't do the same in similar situations.

Quote:
The media only got one right…they are good table fare. They don’t walk on land, they aren’t going to eat your dogs & cats and grand moms don’t be alarmed, they aren’t going to eat your grand kids. They don’t spawn 5 times a year. They don’t eat everything in sight. They are somewhat shy and lazy.


I mostly agree with this, however thy can spawn up to 5 times in a year. I have no idea if they do where you fish, they absolutely can. That is scientific fact.

They may not eat everything in sight, but they do eat anything they want. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but it is what it is. It's an apex predator in many cases.

Quote:
Basically they are minnow eaters, primary banded killifish and bluegill. I have chased this great gamefish for pushing a decade and I can say I have not seen any change in the fishery. Matter of fact where bass and snakeheads coexist I have seen the bass seem to be larger. I guess this isn’t the snakehead eating the bass (Virginia has open over 1500 snakeheads and found only about 3% bass in their stomachs, BUT, I bet every bass has baby snakeheads in them). They have no hard fins so they are prey for all fish. Why do you think they lay so many eggs? Not many will survive.


Actually if you are seeing larger bass, it likely does mean the snakeheads are eating the smaller bass. Removing the smaller and midsize bass is one of the keys to managing a pond for bigger bass. I could explain this more, but don't feel a need.

I don't know where you got the 3% figure, but if you understand predator prey relationships (and ratios), this number isn't at all out of line. PRey always outnuber predators by a huge amount. So, 3% doesn't mean that they aren't eating many bass. Relatively speaking, they likely are. It just means they aren't specifically targeting bass. In other words, they are indiscriminate just like most predators.

Quote:
I have always thought that most folks that fly the banner… “Kill the snakehead” and wants you to know it, has never caught one, for if they had they too would see what great battlers they are. Any fisherman that likes bass fishing surely will like the fight of a snakehead. [quote]

I am positive I would like it. But then, I'd probably still kill it.

[quote]Maybe not the bass tournament guys, they think they are going to eat all their beloved bass, which by the way was introduced and are not native. These guys feel the same way about chain pickerel which they believe don’t belong in THEIR waters. They don’t know that the pickerel is a native fish that once covered the whole east coast and all the way to the Mississippi. Maybe the introduction of the bass in their waters took a toll, because they aren’t everywhere anymore.[quote]

There is some truth to what you said, but it also looks like you are willing to overlook the bad simply because you enjoy catching them.

[quote]A few fishermen lose the full fighting aspect of snakehead by fishing with bait on the bottom, yes they will catch fish and that is alright, but these fish are one of the best top water fish around. The whole experience is visible, from the initial follow to the sound of the fish closing its jaw on the bait. Its music to my ears, can’t get enough of it.


Same could be said for Arapaima. Should we introduce those because they are fun to catch?

Quote:
Before I decided to go on this rant, I looked up the bowfin on Wikipedia. This fish is a close second to the snakehead in many ways and they have been around for 30,000,000 years and guess what, haven’t destroyed the environment.


Actually longer. I don't remember all of the details, but I believe it is the only surviving species from a family of fish that was around during the Jurassic period. But this argument is actually irrelevant. They weren't transplanted because somebody liked eating them or catching them

Quote:
More and more fishermen are touting the fishing quality of the snakehead and feel as strong as I do they are a worthy opponent. It has been taking time and we snakeheaders need to help educate folks that they aren’t the “frankenfish” that the media and uninformed believe or what they want you to believe without any scientific information. So the next time someone says…”Kill the snakehead” just ask them if they have ever caught one. You already know the answer, just walk away; they don’t know what we know.

IMG_00https://joebruceflyfishing.wordpress.com


There is some truth to that. I'm sure they are fun to catch. But explain to me how a decision based on whether I caught one and liked it, is not Science. There is science out there if you care to look.

Posted on: 2018/7/18 8:43
_________________
Hank Patterson for President.




« 1 (2) 3 4 5 ... 8 »



You can view topic.
You cannot start a new topic.
You cannot reply to posts.
You cannot edit your posts.
You cannot delete your posts.
You cannot add new polls.
You cannot vote in polls.
You cannot attach files to posts.
You cannot post without approval.

[Advanced Search]





Site Content
Login
Sponsors
Stay Connected

twitterfeed.com facebook
USGS Water Levels <Click Map>
Polls
The New Keystone Fly Fishing Book





Copyright 2019 by PaFlyFish.com | Privacy Policy| Provided by Kile Media Group | Design by 7dana.com