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Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2006/9/11 12:00
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Does anyone besides me have a WAY higher missed fish ratio on stocked fish than on wild fish? My main dry fly stocked fish stream is Oil Creek. I compare the takes on dries there to the takes on other larger wild brown streams, not little to medium wild fish streams like Pithole, Hemlock and the like. I'm comparing streams where I usually catch 12" fish and are of a flow not unlike Oil Creek (say, 100-400 cfs, ball park). I'm at about 50% on Oil Creek and have been for about 25 years. Ratios are much better on Penns/Spring/ L. J. Like 80-90% of surface takes = hook-ups.

Syl

Posted on: 2/4 14:18


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild
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2016/1/24 14:30
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I don't think this has been the case for me, but I'm going off subjective recollection rather than serious observation.

For me, I think, the ratio has been pretty close. I have noticed that, for me, small wild brookies' hookup ratio is less than for larger trout, both stocked and wild. This is probably just due to their aggressive nature and smaller mouths.

Some stocked trout populations, such as the fish in the special reg section of Yellow Breeches, can become very hard for me to hook on dry flies.

In the case you descibe, I wonder what it is about stockies in Oil Creek that leads to this outcome? I'm not an Oil Creek guy so can't compare it to the LJ/Penns etc. Although the flows are comparable, could it be that Oil Creek has more flat water and slower currents? It does seem to me that trout of all types in flat water that gets a lot of angling pressure can be sensitive eaters and hard to hook. This is especially true come late spring and early summer.

Posted on: 2/4 14:29


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2009/10/15 12:02
From Dispositionally, one mile south of Lake LeBoeuf
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There are a lot of factors that could in combination with each other produce the results Syl is discussing. Pressured fish that become tentative risers. To Dave's point, a lot of the better dry fly water on the stream is relatively flat. Oil Creek is relatively fertile and the imperative to seize feeding opportunities you often see with freestone wild fish may be less of a factor.

Could be due to a lot of different reasons...

But sometimes, the simplest answer makes the most sense. As in: What is the average distance from your rod tip where you set the hook on an Oil Creek fish compared to the same measurement from say, Hemlock?

Much of the difference could be a simple matter of the physics of setting the hook with more vs. less line out. Or so it would seem to me, at any rate..

Posted on: 2/4 15:19


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2006/9/9 16:08
From Erie Co.
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Have to agree with RLeep2. I do find that these fish pressured and I do run into a number of them with ripped moth mandibles as the season progresses.

Posted on: 2/4 15:34


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2016/10/19 18:43
From Beaver Falls. PA.
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I think it's because of the length of line your throwing ( down in the flat water ) and it gets magnified as the season goes on with the fish getting wary...... I fish Oil Crick about 3 times a week starting late March - early April , and I noticed last year the hatches seemed off..( real late in the evening and even no fish rising during a light hatch) Any comments Syl ??????

Posted on: 2/4 17:06


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2007/10/7 0:44
From philadelphia
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I find that it is fairly often that stockies are harder to catch than wild fish .

Whether with a dry fly ,or even in the art of wet fly fishing .

Posted on: 2/4 22:45


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2006/9/21 0:02
From Pittsburgh
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I know that the fish in the park at petroleum center can be pretty picky.
And - as others have mentioned - that's a result of the fishing pressure that stretch receives. But on other, more remote sections of oil creek - I haven't noticed a higher ratio of missed strikes.

In most cases though, I've always considered stocked fish to be easier to catch on top.
People that I have taught to fish always seem to do better on ATW's, that WT streams.
And that was the case for me when I first started this sport

Posted on: 2/5 1:09


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2010/3/29 6:56
From cambria county
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LOL I miss both of them equall and pretty much most of the takes I get I miss. Think that why I stick to the bottom.

Posted on: 2/5 13:16
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Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2009/12/30 20:55
From NW Penna
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Yes those Oil Creek stockies can get picky.. And if you are following Dano, just put a streamer on..

Posted on: 2/5 14:17
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Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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Quote:

SmoothOperator wrote:
I noticed last year the hatches seemed off..( real late in the evening and even no fish rising during a light hatch) Any comments Syl ??????


I haven't seen a sulfur hatch like I was used to for...yeesh... I don't know how many years. Grannoms just kinda went POOF! In late May into June, I used to be able to fish a Cornuta or drunella spinner fall at 5:30. It was so good many years ago that I would be leaving the creek just as the sulfur crowd showed up. I don't see that bug much anymore.

The well plugging work continues but it doesn't seem to be helping.

Syl

Posted on: 2/5 18:42


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2016/10/19 18:43
From Beaver Falls. PA.
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Quote:

Sylvaneous wrote:
Quote:

SmoothOperator wrote:
I noticed last year the hatches seemed off..( real late in the evening and even no fish rising during a light hatch) Any comments Syl ??????


I haven't seen a sulfur hatch like I was used to for...yeesh... I don't know how many years. Grannoms just kinda went POOF! In late May into June, I used to be able to fish a Cornuta or drunella spinner fall at 5:30. It was so good many years ago that I would be leaving the creek just as the sulfur crowd showed up. I don't see that bug much anymore.

The well plugging work continues but it doesn't seem to be helping.

Syl
. So it's not my imagination.....Sulphurs that don't start /materialize to way to late or not at all.......Caddis hatches going on with only sporadic surface action....... Seems last two maybe three years........Probably met you up there, because I've had this conversation with about a 1/2 dozen people up there in the last few seasons......

Posted on: 2/5 22:53


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2010/8/4 11:18
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I only fish for large wild trout. Just kidding, I don't find much of a difference.

Posted on: 2/7 13:27


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2016/2/27 7:56
From Maryland
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My dad used to say hatchery trout couldn't see straight. Stocked trout making violent passes at streamers is just part of fishing over stocked trout in April. I suspect the dry fly problem is more of the same: the fish are used to just swimming around with their mouths open and the pellets practically fall in when they swim near what they're trying to eat.

There is a bit of technique to add, though I've found it more helpful while fishing beetle patterns over wild fish and those that are established in a creek. Wait a split second before setting the hook. The casual take of a dry fly, especially something large like a beetle, occurs in slow motion compared to the violent strike on a streamer, or the quick sampling of a bit of debris suspended in the water column. Don't strike when the fish takes the fly, but wait until it's head is back under water (at least in relatively still water). It's hard to learn and I regularly miss nice fish by getting too excited and striking early, but I've also followed my own advice and had a nice trout on a dry to show for it.



Posted on: 2/7 21:01


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2017/3/21 10:15
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As for the insect life very low summer cfs. Warm temps over the years in my humble opinion of fishing this stream for about
40 years May be a good culprit.

Posted on: 2/21 14:37


Re: Surface takes of Dries: Stocked vs. Wild

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2006/9/13 10:18
From LV
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Never took it into account, I think if the trout are rising the numbers are going to be nearly the same. I do know however that when I see a trout rise to a dry fly I'm fishing it' more likely that I'll set the hook too early.

Posted on: 2/26 14:59
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