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Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2006/12/13 9:28
From Other side of the tracks
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gulfgreyhound wrote:
There are supposed to be some Atlantic's in Connecticut.Massachusetts has ,had a salmon hatchery in Belchertown to stock the Connecticut River.Mass has quite a few sea run brown streams out on the Cape and west of there.Atlantic's ran the Delaware and the Hudson in Colonial times.
obviously the problem is pollution and dams.Better idea might be a trial of Atlantic's in the Erie Feeders. imo


I did a little research, and apparently the historical southern most range of Atlantic salmon in the US was Long Island sound and as far as rivers go, the Hudson.

The Deleware river apparently never had them.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 9:07
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Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2006/9/10 16:07
From Pine Grove
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Quote:

gulfgreyhound wrote:
.Better idea might be a trial of Atlantic's in the Erie Feeders. imo


The whole reason Pacific salmonids were introduced into the great lakes is because alewife are toxic to Atlantics, or at least block their ability to process thiamin during reproduction. Until alewife are eradicated from the GL system, Atlantics can not be self sustaining.

Boyer

Posted on: 2010/9/1 9:13


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
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There is a perfectly healthy population of wild trout in that system. The idea of stocking steelhead, to me, is absurd. I really hope this doesn't happen. Save the steelhead for the rivers that don't have anything else going for them.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 9:23


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2006/9/11 11:30
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The Delaware has been subject to all sorts of experiments for 140 years. Atlantic salmon were tried starting in the 1870's for a few decades - mostly stocked in the Musconetcong and at the springs off Hummer's Beach north of Easton. One appeared in the Bushkill in Easton. Nobody could hook it, so someone just shot it. Shad netters got a few each year, but they never returned in a big way. Chinook were tried at the same time and never got any return. The mouth of the Delaware is a tad south of the native range of Atlantic salmon on either side of the Atlantic which is somewhere around the 40 to 41 parallel.

Steelhead have been tried a number of times going back to the 19th century. Back in the 60's I remember they were stocked in Van Campen's Brook. Nothing really returned.

NJ has been trying to start a sea-run brown run in the Manasquan. Only a few are caught each year, 90% by a single person. Some think the Tom's R would be a better choice and some suggested trying the sea run brookie stock from the Connetquot on Long Island, but the IPN outbreak there stopped any discussions.

The non-native fish introduced to the Delaware drainage is a long list:
Smallmouth bass
Largemouth Bass
Rock Bass
Walleye
Northern Pike
Muskie
Rainbow trout
Brown Trout
Bluegill
Carp
Flathead catfish
channel catfish

Many more fish were tried. The TU position is typically to quit playing around with introducing non-native species and focus on protecting what we have left.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 11:08


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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re: great lakes atlantics

Atlantics are showing some signs of a fragile recovery. Atlantics have started successfully spawning at Sault St Marie and they have been showing up in greater numbers in the Ontario tribs. A couple of interesting theories are that EMS resistant strains are developing (Sault Ste marie) and that the Atlantics (and the browns) have been switching to a goby diet. Gobies are another introduced pest and people are watching how the predator prey balance between gobies and salmonids turns out. Some questions about EMS in the Fingers too. One peak alewife year on Seneca appeared to be a low EMS year. One theory is the another factor may be that the thiaminase level in alewives might be due to stress levels on the alewife population.

Introduction of lampreys (native to Fingers and Lake O) caused laker populations to crash and the introduced alewife population to explode (who remembers the foot deep scum of dead alewives on the GL beaches in the 1960's?) and then Pacific salmon were the cure, then the zebra and quagga mussels were introduced, then the water cleared and the bait populations shifted, then kings got thinner and steelies scarcer, then gobies were introduced and went wild, then introduced shrimp displaced the native mysis shrimp possibly affecting juvenile fish growth, then questions about other causes of laker decline cropped up, then browns started to fatten up on gobies and get huge, and then atlantics may have gotten into the act, and steelhead runs have come back (or exceded) 1980's levels. Kokanees/pinks were the rage for a while - not many left today.

It has been a wild ride with introduced species in the Great Lakes.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 11:34


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2009/10/15 12:02
From Dispositionally, one mile south of Lake LeBoeuf
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>>Better idea might be a trial of Atlantic's in the Erie Feeders. imo>>

If they're gonna do that, they better develop a strain that can travel on land. By the time the powers that be finally decide there are enough steelhead and browns in the creeks, where are the salmon going to lay in the creek?

The only place I can think of is out on the bank...

What a clust... aww, never mind...:)

Posted on: 2010/9/1 11:36


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2009/10/15 12:02
From Dispositionally, one mile south of Lake LeBoeuf
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If memory serves, NJ once proposed a Kings or Coho program for the D. I forget which. The notion didn't float for very long before dying a rapid and well deserved death.

I think this steelhead idea deserves the same.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 11:38


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2006/9/13 22:36
From Tioga co. formerly of bucks co.
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The big "D" has some sea run browns, some years better than others. I have never caught or heard of any above Easton though. most of the sea runs I have caught were below new hope wing dam and scudders falls. A few were in the 10-12 lb. range. kenny schram, I and few others fished for them for years. They are still around but i will not give out any more info.

N.J. has tried salmon and steelhead on and off for years, nothing ever happens. The Big D" is not conducive to them. To warm, not the right geography for them. Same for Atlantics.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 11:42
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Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2006/9/11 14:30
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Just to vent, whats wrong with what we got! The D is bottom line the healthiest fishery and waterway in the eastern US! What else could you ask for? It has the best tailwater fishery in the US, it is a superb small mouth fishery, it has an recovering shad and striped bass population, and the best and maybe not the least the atlantic sturgeon is making an impressive comeback. And from a sport fishing perspective, pound for pound, IMO, shad fight better than pa mut steelhead, and they're native. If anything, I think the current issues of drilling shale-water quality, water usage, invasives (mud snail, rock snot, asian carp, zebra mussels to name a few) and watershed sustainability should be the subjects of conversation and should be talked about until there is nothing else to talk about.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 13:24
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Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2007/1/2 11:55
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I love the D as well, but I think it's very far from the best tailwater fishery in the US. Very far.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 13:26


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2009/9/14 12:48
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Quote:
I love the D as well, but I think it's very far from the best tailwater fishery in the US. Very far.


I assume he meant the eastern US.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 13:28


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2006/9/11 14:30
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My apologies, thought that could be implied. For argument sake, I say in the US it is top 5 because of public access. As for the fishery top 10.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 13:39
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Perhaps fishing is, for me, only an excuse to be near rivers.


Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2009/5/18 17:57
From Toona
Posts: 559
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1) Upper Delaware River (NY, PA)
Threat: Gas drilling
The Upper Delaware River provides drinking water for 17 million people across Pennsylvania and New York. Unfortunately, this clean water source is threatened by natural gas extraction activities in the Marcellus Shale, where chemicals are injected into the ground creating untreatable toxic wastewater. The Delaware River Basin Commission must not issue permits for gas drilling in this watershed until a thorough study of impacts is completed. Congress must also pass the Fracturing Responsibility and Awareness of Chemicals Act of 2009.

I agree with skeeter, except about the best tailwater in the US. We should focus more on maintaining and continuing the fishery that already exists. I've never even been there, but from reading books and talking to other anglers, it seems like a very fine waterway to me.



Source: http://www.americanrivers.org/newsroo ... -rivers-2010-6-2-2010.htm

Posted on: 2010/9/1 13:41
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Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2007/10/17 10:49
From florida
Posts: 6399
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Best tailwaters fishery:Most any bottom release TVA Lake.
Delaware is a special case due to the propose gas drilling that needs to be regulated or better yet stopped.Like the gulf oil spill,we'll pay for it mentality, after the damage is done and who knows the long term effects.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 13:57
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Re: Steelhead in the Delaware River?

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2007/3/26 22:22
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Jay,
During good hatch periods and when the flows good, the experience might change your ranking the D. It has many problems and if the flows can be managed a little better, it will be scary good. The crazy hot summer hasn't helped things and temp around Lordville exceeded 80 several times. I'm sure there's been some mortality due to stress and temps that has flown under the radar.

GG,
No mention of the White or Little Red as top tailwater in US? That's even closer to your neck of the woods.

There's probably too many great tailwaters to mention.
Big Horn
Green River
White River
Delaware
quite a few in the Smokies
take your pick in Idaho, Montana, Oregon, etc.

We've got a good one here, let's not f it up. To the Lehigh lovers, it's close to being a dud like the Tully. Better tailwaters that should get new release plans and better attention... Kinzua and Raystown.

Posted on: 2010/9/1 15:01



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