Rules and Regs.....

S

Siggymanx33

New member
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
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Good afternoon all,

I was hoping you could help me settle a dispute that I'm having with a good friend.

My friend seems to think it was ok to fish on the Darby Creek over this past weekend. This is a recently stocked stream that is located right outside of Philadelphia.

The way I read the rules, this is considered Approved Trout Waters and is off limits from March 1st to opening day.

The way he reads the rules is as long as he's catching and releasing he's good to go. As a matter af fact, he told me a bunch of people were fishing?

If I'm wrong, I owe him a big appology.

If he's wrong, well then ....he's just wrong.

First post, but a long time reader of the board.

Thanks for any help!
 
Do not fish means do not fish! If your friend thinks he's right let him go by himself. It is not permitted even with catch and release. We fish pretty much year round and are careful not to fish approved waters on or after March 1st.

It is not OK to catch and release on approved trout waters from March 1st until the legal season begins.

Did you bet on it?
 
Didn't bet on it but I had some very strong words for him.

He feels that he's right so instead of continuing to call him a a@@hole for poaching and accusing him of not being a sportsman, I really wanted to make sure I was correct.
 
I'm pretty sure your right and he's wrong. Yes Darby is an ATW but it's not open to year round fishing. It's closed from 3-1 to opening day 4-4 Tell him to read page 11 in the fishing summary. But then again in the words of "Tim Wilson" I could be wrong......... I fished the Little J and Spruce this past week end and I know I was in the right. All catch and release.
 
I don't know the stream in question well. Right now, you are not permitted to fish ATW, or anywhere downstream of ATW, it doesn't matter whether you keep them or not, you can't fish. You are allowed to fish places upstream of ATW's, as well as special regulations areas.

Looking up Darby Creek on the PAFBC site (Delaware County, right?), they actually list limits on the ATW, which isn't that common. The upper end of the ATW is 0.5 upstream of confluence with Little Darby (the lower end is Hilldale Rd.). Anywhere above the upper limit you should be able to fish, below it and its illegal. If you're friend was below it, he was breaking the law, and if he saw others they were breaking the law too.
 
If you were truely a long time reader you would have seen this topic many times -- just jerking around. :)

What the others have said is correct. ATW and any water below ATW is off limits.
I hate the below ATW thing. There are a few streams around here that have populations of wild trout and the streams don't get stocked. However, up stream aways they stock a bucket or two for the local kids.
 
If you look in the PFBC book you get with your license you can get a list of approved trout waters for your county. Anything on that list make no mistake, you cannot fish from March 1st until the legal season begins. There are different regs for extended harvest and trophy tout areas so read those carefully, you can fish them catch & release only but everyone should read the regs. Spring is almost here and everyone is getting anxious to hit the stream. If he's a friend take him to breakfast and forget your wallet. :) Cheaper than a fine. He owes you for being able to read. :)
 
Hmmm, that's funny, I seem to have misplaced my rule book, I guess that pretty much opens up the whole state for me. I mean come on, I'm a catch and release kinda guy.

I wish sometimes I could still let ignorance get the better of me but most of the time my subconscience kicks me in the *** and says " Yes Jake, you do have the catch and release mentality, but no, you still can't fish here right now, and the WCO's will not discriminate between the unlawful corn chuckers and an unlawful fly angler with barbless hooks". That is because no fishing means no fishing and sometimes we forget because were so used to releasing fish all year anyway. For me, Opening Day and all it's hoopla comes and goes. But for me, opening day just means lots of cars and people everywhere . Just the other day at Muddy Creek a WCO was glassing the FFO stretch just below the wire and a thought occurred to me. And I was thinking about it while I was talking to him. I know that this general area is FFO, but being March, the pool just above the bridge is just below the wire ending the Catch And Release Fly Fishing Only stretch open to fishing year round. I could definately see myself or another fly angler wading past that wire to fish that hole without any thought or guilty feeling about it, just out of normal routine or habit. I've seen plenty of pics with that hole in the background. I've never fished that hole myself, I always drive past it not particularly liking that spot. Well, if someone were to have done that Saturday just around noon they'd have gotten popped for it, catch and release or not because most catch and release areas border on approved waters. And approved waters are out of season. I almost went to a new spot somewhere else this past weekend and remebered that even though it was not an area that is stocked, it is still an approved trout stream, and unless otherwise listed most approved waters are under general regulations from mouth to the tribs. and it is that magical time of year when it seems you can't fish anywhere because the stocking trucks have arrived.
 
I think barbed wire and pitbulls would keep us all legal. I have a hard time since we have special reg waters and we try to fish year round. It is hard especially when they describe the points so you have to have a brain wired to GPS. Maybe electro shock. Shock once for catch & release, shock twice for get out of the water now.
 
I live 15 minutes from Darby Creek and your "friend" is poaching! :-x That water is closed until April 4th.
 
yep he was breaking the law. Personally, friend or not, id call a WCO the next time he goes.
 
Downstream areas are not closed to fishing from March 1 to Opening Day unless they are themselves ATWs. If a stream is designated ATW in one County and flows downstream into another County where it is NOT designated ATW, then it is NOT closed to fishing during the period mentioned in the downstream County. Likewise, where an upper and lower limit is designated, then it is NOT closed below or above those limits. The concept of "downstream areas" only comes into play during the Extended Season, Labor Day to February last, in allowing harvest in areas not specifically designated ATW, but downstream of them.

§ 63.3. Fishing in approved trout waters.
It is unlawful to fish in approved trout waters regulated under § 61.1 (relating to Commonwealth inland waters) from 12:01 a.m. on March 1 to 8 a.m. on the first Saturday after April 11 and in approved trout waters regulated under § 65.12 (relating to Regional Opening Day of Trout Season Program) from 12:01 a.m. on March 1 to 8 a.m. on the first Saturday after March 28. As used in this subpart, the term ‘‘approved trout waters’’ means designated waters that contain significant portions that are open to public fishing and are stocked with trout. A listing of approved trout waters is published in the Commission’s ‘‘Summary of Fishing Regulations and Laws,’’ which is available from the Commission at Post Office Box 67000, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania 17106-7000. The Executive Director or a designee may, from time to time, supplement or modify the list of approved trout waters, and additions or deletions will be published in the Pennsylvania Bulletin.


§ 65.26. Extended trout seasons.
(a) General rule. The extended trout season is in effect from the day after Labor Day until the last day of February of the following year on approved trout waters and all waters downstream of approved trout waters. A creel limit of three trout per day and a minimum size limit of 7 inches applies during this season.

 
Ya but it sounds like his friend was fishing in the ATW. That is illegal.
 
I was only addressing the misinformation in two or more of the above posts.
 
Darby Creek is only in Delaware Co. The season doesn't open until April 4th and his "friend" is poaching.
 
Taking it one step further. The Darby upstream is designated as ATW. The Darby downsteam from this area is also ATW.

The commision for some reason had segmented these sections.

Everything in this area except for the FFO section of Ridley and the Valley are ATW.

I've known this for years. His insistance had me second guessing myself.

Edit...(what I mean by this is the Darby is segmented into 3 sections for stocking purposes.....all ATW)
 
If the section he fished is designated ATW, it is most certainly closed presently unless under a trumping special regulation. You run the risk of conviction just possessing equipment within 25 feet of the water.*

My post was merely correcting the incorrect statements made that downstream areas of ATWs are also closed. They are not. I am not sure if there are more than a handful of stream sections that would fall into this category, but if you want to have an accurate understanding regarding the status of non-ATW downstream areas, I assure you that I gave it to you.

*§ 63.4. Fishing in areas or waters where fishing is prohibited.
There shall be a rebuttable presumption that a person is fishing in violation of this subpart if the person has in his possession a fishing line, rod or other device that may be used for fishing while on or in water where fishing is prohibited or on the banks within 25 feet of the waters.
 
Thanks Jack,

I stand corrected on areas downstream of ATW's. Nevertheless, that apparantly doesn't come into play in this particular question. If its below the junction with Little Darby, or less than 0.5 miles above that, then you cannot fish. More than 0.5 miles above Little Darby and you can fish on a catch and release basis.
 
You're right - he's wrong.
 
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