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PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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Not fishing, I know ...but, a lot of us do both!!
House bill No. 760 is proposing to have all PA guns registered at a cost of $10/gun and reregistered each year... and the owner registered with an annual ID card. Additionally, if your application is rejected your guns will be confiscated.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 14:31


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION
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I am absolutely certain that what you have said about this proposed legislation is misleading at best and outright false at worst. When posting matters that you think may be of interest to the board members and likely to rouse strong opinions, it is advisable to provide a link or source for the info. Otherwise, the discussion that ensues will take a page and a half before anyone is commenting on the actual issue at stake.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 14:53
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Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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House bill 760

Actually I didn't find anything "inaccurate" in what he wrote.

I don't even own a gun but this sound, to me, a little excessive.

Though, as JackM would say...BKIMIHNIWITA

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:06


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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http://www.legis.state.pa.us/CFDOCS/L ... yp=B&billNbr=0760&pn=0881


He speaks the truth!

Write your representative!

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:16


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION
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Well, I looked up the legislation. The Bill has six sponsors only, 4 from Philly and two from Pittsburgh. It is in Committee and may look nothing like what it does now when it comes out.

While it calls for $10 registration and yearly renewal (comparable to a vehicle registration), there is no "annual ID card," but the proposed registration paper is to have a photo of the registered owner.

Finally, there is no provision for confiscation of weapons where permits are rejected. The only reasons for rejection of a registration appear to be where a proposed registered owner: has been convicted of a crime of violence; has been convicted within five years of a drug offense or is ineligible to possess a firearm under any Federal or State law.

A violation of the proposed registration law is a summary offense, as was described here recently, the equivalent of a traffic ticket.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:21
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Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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Quote:

JackM wrote:

Finally, there is no provision for confiscation of weapons where permits are rejected.


Within three days after notification of a
14 decision unfavorable to the applicant and all time for appeal
15 having expired, the applicant shall surrender to the
16 Pennsylvania State Police the firearm for which the applicant
17 was denied registration.

I'm Just Bill, Yes I'm only a bill..."...c'mon everybody sing along...

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:27


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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Look, its bad law, and you shouldn't try and make it seem as if it can just be overlooked and not to worry. There is no room for complacency on issues concerning our rights.

People should at least be aware of the legislature that our elected officials are trying to pass in order to restrict our constitutional rights. Which is a step toward removal of that right.

You are correct, it could look very different by the time it gets voted on! It could be worse.

(h) Denial.--In the event the application is denied, the
8 Pennsylvania State Police shall inform the applicant in writing
9 of the denial. Any applicant who believes that the applicant's
10 application is wrongfully denied may, within ten days after
11 receiving notice of the denial, file a written appeal of the
12 denial in accordance with 2 Pa.C.S. (relating to administrative
13 law and procedure). Within three days after notification of a
14 decision unfavorable to the applicant and all time for appeal
15 having expired, the applicant shall surrender to the
16 Pennsylvania State Police the firearm for which the applicant
17 was denied registration.

A nonrefundable fee of $10 per firearm shall accompany each
18 application for registration of a firearm and renewal of
19 registration of a firearm.

This would cost me close to $300 dollars per year, and there are many others it would cost into the thousands.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:37


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION
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Yes, "surrender." A distinctly different word in meaning and import from "confiscation." As I said, the original statement was most likely to be misleading at best.

To respond directly above, I did not suggest that the proposed legislation is either good or bad, nor did I suggest that he shouldn't have raised it. i just suggested that he post some info on the source so that people responding could make an informed decision based upon what was actually in the law and also could consider whether this was just some wacky proposal or something that was in the least likely to become law.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:37
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Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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They will have to CONFISCATE mine cause I refuse to pay $10 per application per year.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:41


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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Quote:

JackM wrote:
Well, I looked up the legislation. The Bill has six sponsors only, 4 from Philly and two from Pittsburgh. It is in Committee and may look nothing like what it does now when it comes out.

While it calls for $10 registration and yearly renewal (comparable to a vehicle registration), there is no "annual ID card," but the proposed registration paper is to have a photo of the registered owner.


It looks to me like the only part of the original message that was "misleading at best and outright false at worst" was the part about an anual ID. He was talking about the bill the way it exists, not the way it will look when it comes out. how the heck do you know now it will come out?

Quote:
Finally, there is no provision for confiscation of weapons where permits are rejected. The only reasons for rejection of a registration appear to be where a proposed registered owner: has been convicted of a crime of violence; has been convicted within five years of a drug offense or is ineligible to possess a firearm under any Federal or State law. A violation of the proposed registration law is a summary offense, as was described here recently, the equivalent of a traffic ticket.


There may not be a provision for confiscation, but there is a provision for surrendering your firearms of the application comes out unfavorable to the applicant. What do you think will happen if this applicant decides not to surrender those weapons. He can't sell them (covered under a different provision). If this surrender provision stays, do you think a confiscation provision will be added? Before it comes out of course.

You talk about the reason for rejecion. you forgot about this one.

"(3) Is not otherwise ineligible to possess a firearm under any Federal or State law."

That is quite broad. also, what is to stop them from writing new laws? say for instance, state or fed decides everyone need a psycological profile. Or maybe, lets outlaw all handguns. Would they be applicable? It would make it a whole lot easier since they all would be registered. Oops. I mean all the legal ones would be registered.

Any comments about the finger printing?

All that said, I don't see how this could stand up to Constitutional scrutany without a majority of activist judges, so I guess i agree it will probably change quite a bit. just my opinion. But then, i am no lawyer. I read it in plain English, not lawyerese.


So, who exactly is being "misleading at best and outright false at worst" in the conversation?

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:49
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There are certain pursuits which, if not wholly poetic and true, do at least suggest a nobler and finer relation to nature than we know. The keeping of bees, for instance." -Henry David Thoreau--


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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Jack:
Thanks for your "friendly suggestions" on the proper procedures to post. Next time I'll check with you first.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:53


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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Hey Jack, that's bull. You know what you said. If not, go read it again.

"misleading at best and outright false at worst."

That's bull.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:54
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There are certain pursuits which, if not wholly poetic and true, do at least suggest a nobler and finer relation to nature than we know. The keeping of bees, for instance." -Henry David Thoreau--


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION
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Quote:

FarmerDave wrote:

So, who exactly is being "misleading at best and outright false at worst" in the conversation?


Since I did, in fact point out all three proposed disqualifications, you will need to look a bit harder or manufacture something out of what I said to find a falsehood or inaccuracy.

Like criminal charges, you can be accused of anything but eventually the charges must be proved. With legislation, anything can be proposed, but it must also be passed into law. So I think the more reasonable approach to debate on legislative proposals is to have an accurate idea of what is being proposed and to further consider the likelihood of it making it to a floor vote in the form it is proposed-- both legitimate points to discuss and nothing I said suggests otherwise.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:56
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Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION

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You got me on that one point, but what about the rest of what I said?

Posted on: 2007/4/5 15:58
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There are certain pursuits which, if not wholly poetic and true, do at least suggest a nobler and finer relation to nature than we know. The keeping of bees, for instance." -Henry David Thoreau--


Re: PROPOSED GUN REGISTRATION
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Quote:

baetis wrote:
Jack:
Thanks for your "friendly suggestions" on the proper procedures to post. Next time I'll check with you first.


No need to check with me at all. You can post misleading information anytime you please.

Posted on: 2007/4/5 16:00
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Peace, Tony



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