Odd catch pattern on north west brown stream.

[Cornholio]

So there is a creek in northwest PA that I have fished on a regular basis for a number of years. It has a reputation of producing large Wild Brown Trout and is listed as a class A stream. The trout on my avatar was taken from this creek last september. The funny thing is I have never taken a brown less than 12 inches from this stream. Why would that be? shouldn't there be plenty of smaller browns? keep in mind I have been fishing the entirety of this creek roughly 30 times a year for the last few years. This stream is a trib to a stocked stream that is a trib to the allegheny river. Some of you know what stream i am talking about. I am just curious to hear some opinions on this.... sorry for the lack of paragraphs smart phones suck!

 

[wildtrout2]

Check out my "Few small trout" thread, a few pages back. You might get some helpful info from it.

 

[dryflyguy]

You can PM me the stream, and I'll gladly go check it out to see if I can figure out why it holds only big fish.

There is a stream in central PA that, when I first started fishing it years ago, I rarely caught any thing under 12". That has changed lately however. And I now catch many smaller fish in it too

 

[pcray1231]

I know the stream well and my experiences over the years mirror yours. I used to fish it a lot, more recently it's been like once a year though.

The answer is where those fish are from. They did not grow up in the stream. They grew up in the Allegheny River. I'm reasonably certain of that.

That's why there's such a high number of BIG fish for the water. It's also why there are few small guys, they're out in the river. Yes, I have caught em in the river, but you only find em at certain times of the year as they grow very quickly.

 

[greenghost]

I'm not sure what stream you're referring to, but pcray is probably correct. For whatever reason, there are many streams up that way that see migrant fish.

Years ago, I used to fish many Allegheny River and Clarion River tributaries. And I would notice an influx of big fish at two times of the year: when the temperature rose beyond the comfort zone in the rivers and/or during the fall (spawn time) for browns. As standalone trout steams, many of these streams were not Class A or even B, and had lousy populations of trout... but during certain times of the year that changed.

One of my favorites was a small insignificant stream that emptied into the Clarion around Cooksburg. I'd make a pilgrimage there every year to fish for big brownies pre-spawn. In a stream that was stocked with 10-inchers, I would every now and then catch fish double that size. But because the stream was so small, they were not easy to hook.

 

[streamerguy]

If it's the stream I'm thinking of, and possibly the one pcray is thinking of, then I have caught one small brown in there around maybe 5in, but the rest of the browns were much bigger.

Now these fish coming from the river, are they mostly the stocked fingerlings? Or were they born in the small tribs, and eventually swam down to the river for a few years and came back up the tribs?

 

[pcray1231]

I'm not sure. I always assumed them to be wild. This stream, and the one it runs into, do have wild browns.

But, the stream it runs into is also stocked, with ADULT brown trout. And of course, the Allegheny is stocked with fingerlings, and while that's well upstream of here, it is well known that those fish come down.

Any of the above COULD be the source of these browns. But I still guess them to be wild based on genetics. Spot patterns very different from the PAFBC hatchery strain.

 

[FarmerDave]

Pat confirmed my suspician on what stream you are talking about, and thanks for not naming it. Don't be mad at him for giving it up. He knows that is my old stomping grounds.

Pat is also correct about the source of most of those big browns, but he forgot one other source.

Here is a hint. Have you tried the bread fly or a corn fly?

Yep, you guys are fishing over pet trout.

I know the stream well. I won't say much more cept that I don't like fishing in other peoples back yard ... cept for my little brother's place.;-)

If you want to catch small ones (and less big ones,) just go upstream beyond the last cabin.

But as long as you guys are fishing for the pet trout, there is less pressure on the wild ones.

Have caught a few small ones (sub legal) and have seen a few obviously wild and bery skinny one in the 10 to 13 inch range further upstream.

 

[Squaretail]

Like the new avatar Dave.

 

[Cornholio]

Dave, you are right on the stream, but i always walk past the cabins before i start to fish and i make a day of it and fish it up where you can hear the cars humming down the main road. I know the entire creek very well, in fact the majority of the big fish i have taken have been way up stream in the meadow section, so maybe things have changed since 1920 lol jk.

 

[streamerguy]

Yeah it's the one I'm thinking of too. Pet trout? So are these fish "stocked" in there by the camp owners? Or are they just somehow getting the wild trout to feed on bread and corn?

All the browns(which aren't many, 3 to be exact, 5in, 12in, and 18in) I have caught/seen all were wild from what I could tell.

 

[Cornholio]

Dave, Pcray,Streamer Guy, Dryflyguy, you guys know the stream. If anyone wants to know just pm me. I don't mind telling you guys. it's the "outsiders" that i worry about.

 

[ryguyfi]

I've fished the stream once.

Got skunked.

Took a spill.

And busted a reel.


It's been good to me!


I was meaning to fish that area more the past 2 years, but 2 kids under 2 has some how not allowed me to do so....

 

[FarmerDave]

Cornholio wrote:
Dave, you are right on the stream, but i always walk past the cabins before i start to fish and i make a day of it and fish it up where you can hear the cars humming down the main road. I know the entire creek very well, in fact the majority of the big fish i have taken have been way up stream in the meadow section, so maybe things have changed since 1920 lol jk.

Taken?

Shame on you! ;-)

It has been a few years for me,but you clearly know it better than I do.

 

[FarmerDave]

Streamerguy. Nobody stocks it as far as I know, but I do know of at least one person who feeds the pet trout behind his place on that stream. I doubt he is the only one. But mostly I was joking.

Ryan, I know of someone who has you beat. I know at least one person on here who will remember Dave Curan (I think that was his name). He used to visit this site years ago and was big in TU at one time. He took a friend fishing there once who actually broke a fly line. How the hell...

 

[PatrickC]

I will fo shizzle be looking for prespawn brownies on this stream and it's neighbor in the Fall. I can't wait to see them in their spawning colors. And those browns are definitely from the big river that came up to spawn and decided to stay.

I saw a big bow the last time I was there that I wish I would have caught to see if it was wild. The thing was approaching steelhead size. I wondered if it was a stocker from the stream below. I have seen a few larger wild bows in there, but not quite that large.

 

[pcray1231]

I've broken fly lines. Not there, but just sayin. The last time I did it I was standing on some of it and then pulled it somehow, it caught one of the studs in my boots and got shaved in half. It didn't literally "break", but it was unusable after that.

I took a good spill on that stream too, cracked a tooth all the way into the gum and lost my camera there. Yes, the browns are above the cabin section too. Though it's been a good while since I went way up.

 

[Cornholio]

taken= caught and released, never kept a fish from there or any other wild strem dave

 

[FarmerDave]

I know, just messing with you.

 

[Chaz]

There are streams that hold good numbers of large trout where you don't find the smaller trout, there's probably more than one reason for this. In the case of your stream since I know nothing about the stream in question, I agree with pcray.
I have found other streams that have low angler use, and poor food base yet the trout get big because they eat everything possible, from aphids to other fish. Trout eating other fish is the single biggest reason why when you find big trout and few or no little trout, a population grows quickly and large. The ability to move into and out of large streams helps, think Pine Creek in NC PA.
Chubs are an excellent food base to grow large trout.
Dave makes another excellent point if there is a mixed population of stockies and wild fish and people are feeding the fish the fish will will grow large. Many clubs stock fish in small streams just to give camps something to fish for and the people in the camps or club members feed them