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Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Well, it's saying it's fine to take up to 5 legal trout, which it is.

I mean, I don't do it, but I have no problem with someone taking a limit now and then. My personal test is "if everyone did as I did, would it degrade the fishery?".

Take a limit now and again from varied and relatively unpressured locations, and the answer is no, it wouldn't, even if they are wild fish. Multiple times in a short time frame from the same popular fishery, and that changes.

Nonetheless, yes, I'm putting my own ethics on it slightly beyond what the PFBC mandates. But my "excess" ethics are in the spirit of the PFBC'd, i.e. have fun but do no harm to others' enjoyment of fisheries. Tim's are not, they stem from something else, and I don't fully understand them.

And I do my best not to judge others on their ethics, so long as they are legal. That's why I won't criticize or insult Tim. I was honestly trying to understand his viewpoint. Though I'm pretty sure I strongly disagree with his views, that doesn't mean I dislike him.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 11:43


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Cant believe that my post about brookie streamers turned into a 6 page debate.


Posted on: 2013/1/21 11:54
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Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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You just never know what will start the fire...

Posted on: 2013/1/21 17:37
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Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Quote:

mike_richardson wrote:
Cant believe that my post about brookie streamers turned into a 6 page debate.


This long thread was in response to Tim's post.


Posted on: 2013/1/21 18:45


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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I am glad you guys enjoy exploring, fishing headwaters, and they are certainly scenic and the fish are beautiful, however while I am glad you guys like to catch little brookies it is not for everyone, myself included. I am an oldtimer who feels a little paternal about the little ones and even if you catch them on super light fly outfits it is not for someone like myself who likes to imagine that the fish has a chance of winning the battle. It is simply a matter of personal preference and personally I don't like to catch small fish in tiny waters where they end up on the bank or a rock just trying to escape the hook and line in tiny pools.

Don't get me wrong: have at it and enjoy youself, however there perhaps a few of us who prefer to stay out of the nursery areas and target larger quarry. Yeah sometimes we get a little guy, but they are not the target and we handle every fish with care.

You can argue about the fragile nature of smaller fish versas larger fish and I handle all of them with reverence and appreciate everyone of them, however these days my personal preference is to target larger fish in larger waters.

Maybe ethical is not the right word. Ethos is more like it and like Tim I prefer to target larger fish when I can. There is something about a big fish whipping up on you and sometimes winning that makes you feel that you have not stacked the odds too highly in your favor and have given them a sporting chance, but then again it is a personal preference issue.

I would like to thank Tim for bringing this subject up and while I may be alone I do appreciate and share his ethos. I would rather have a fish test my tackle and me to it limits and that is how I personally feel about sport fishing, but I don't expect anyone else to share that ethos. It may be enthnocentic opinion, but is my own.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:15


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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I

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:27
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Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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I see both sides of the fence. Before I got on the musky ride. I was a die hard brooky guy. I like the exploring for fish in little ditches. I guess the hunt for the unknown water. Now it the same thing with musky fishing. Searching for them. It's just totally different ends of the spectrum.

And another point how many brooky streams are unknown to the pafbc? And I figure exploring these little creeks no matter how small the trout are is worth it. If ya don't know there's a wild population there you can't protect it.....right

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:27
_________________
“If, when you pull a fly out you
don’t hear drums and can’t smell
chicken blood in the air, put it back
in the box, for if it is evil you seek,
then it can only be conjured with the
same.”



Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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I agree Paco and it is a good point about finding them and protecting them, but once I do I look for bigger waters and fish down stream. Maybe it is fish like the tarpon, permit, steelhead, big browns, and authors like Hemmingway, and early big fish pioneers like Gray that gave me this delusional opinion about sport fishing, but I am not looking to change at this late date.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:33

Edited by LongWader on 2013/1/21 19:52:07


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Word. It's really not about preference in the original post. It's about calling the majority of fly fishermen on this website "unethical". No one, I think, would read your post Longwader, and have the sour taste in their mouth that many of us had in reading the OP. Native brook trout fishing and big game fishing are two different games, with two different skillsets and two different goals, I think. That's cool. I frankly enjoy both. There are things I do consider to be unethical, but fishing native waters is not one of them (I would consider the situation jdaddy described on the Tully as unethical, but I think its a far stretch to compare it to small stream C&R practices. The ethical violation probably goes back to the people who decided to stock a fish in a system they know can't support them)

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:44


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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LongWader, and Paco, I have no problem with preferences. I understand them. There are a million types of vastly different styles of fishing and that's part of what makes this sport great.

I too enjoy a variety. My brother is a hardware musky guy and I can join him in that pursuit and enjoy myself. I've spent a few nights catfishing using liver in the big rivers with a beer in my hand and a spinning rod resting on a forked stick. I enjoy a steelhead trip or two on most years. I love catching the evening rise on just about any bug rich, large stream with trout. I'm looking forward to trolling for freakin blue marlin and tuna this summer if I can swing a charter as part of a family vacation. There's no type of fishing I don't like, really.

I do have a soft spot for tiny deep woods streams and brookies. And that's simply my preference. I grew up exploring the big woods and it still feels like home. If I had one day left to fish for the rest of my life I'd choose the most remote, heavily wooded small stream I can find. It's funny how I can be just as thrilled about an 8" brook trout from a jump across stream as I can from a 16" brown on Penns, or a 30 inch steelhead, or a 30 lb yellowfin tuna. It's all relative, those are all "good" fish, but not trophies, and they carry about the same degree of admiration from me. The bottom line is that they are all a day in the great outdoors, and that's what it's really about.

But whatever my preferences, I have no problem with yours, and certainly wouldn't tell you that you're unethical for pursuing them.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:51


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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That's why Baskin Robbins makes 31 different flavors. Each to his own. Anytime 1 have a fly rod in my hand I'm havin a good time and learning or atleast precessing fishing info.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 19:57
_________________
“If, when you pull a fly out you
don’t hear drums and can’t smell
chicken blood in the air, put it back
in the box, for if it is evil you seek,
then it can only be conjured with the
same.”



Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Yep, a preference issue, and I am glad that there are folks who are willing to thin the herd so that some fish can get bigger. There is nothing that tastes better than native brookies cooked in a little bacon grease deep in the woods over a camp fire especially after a hard day of hiking and fishing.

Those big pelagics will humble you and those big reef donkeys or blue fins will make you holler for mercy sometimes.

8" brookies are fine with me, but I still can hope for bigger ones.

I grew up exploring the woods with my airdale rozzy and that is why I sold my big house, bought a big wooded lot with a trout stream and two unnamed brooks, and built a little cottage with a wood stove in the middle of it. My dogs and I do a visual trout stream inventory every day on our hikes along the streams. I even trained my airdale not to swim where I was fishing so I could enjoy her company and fish. It is the same with my current dogs.

I get a charge out of seeing the trout work there way up into the little spring fed brooks every fall to spawn, but to me that is sacred ground. My preference is not to harrass them once they get there.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 20:00

Edited by LongWader on 2013/1/21 20:17:47
Edited by LongWader on 2013/1/21 20:21:08
Edited by LongWader on 2013/1/21 20:21:58


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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2009/10/15 13:45
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Quote:

Chaz wrote:
You can't say that C & R is a good thing on the Tully at that location in August, if you're fishing there they aren't wild fish and they should be harvested because more then likely they will die after being caught. Fishing for any trout in water that is over 70 is unethical.


Is that not EXACTLY what I said?

Quote:

The_Sasquatch wrote:
(I would consider the situation jdaddy described on the Tully as unethical, but I think its a far stretch to compare it to small stream C&R practices. The ethical violation probably goes back to the people who decided to stock a fish in a system they know can't support them)


On this subject matter you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 22:21


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Posted on: 2013/1/21 22:23


Re: From the minnow chaser thread - An ethics lesson

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Okay.

Posted on: 2013/1/21 22:31



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