Emergers?

[lilkobain8848xo]

Does anyone here fish emergers? Someone was telling me i should give them a try but i dont know what kind to use what sizes and when to use certain ones. Any help would be awesome!

 

[flybop]

There are times that emergers will out fish dries by a wide margin. What really turned me on to the effectiveness of emergers was reading some of Gary La Fontain's writing. I am a huge fan of his theories and his use of Antron in emerger patterns. Here is a link to his site, http://www.thebookmailer.com/ . This is a commercial site, but if you dig a little you can find some patterns and see many of his fly designs. Some of his patterns are addmittedly a bit off the wall, but if you take his emergent sparkle pupa and tweak it for the various mayfly species you will be very pleased with the results.

Here is a pic of a fly that has been extremely effective for me. In fact, I need to tie many of this fly this winter. There is no specific pattern, but here is a starting point.

Size 12 to 18 hook, sparkle dubbing to match the bud, clear Antron for tail and overwing, spares, partridge for the underwing. There is no wrong way to fsih this fly. As a trailer behind a dry, swung as a wet and also swinging behind a heavy bugger.

 

[MKern]

I fish emergers all of the time.
However, I'm in the boat of going without antron shucks. To me that stuff acts like fiberoptics and reflects too much light, especially at the tips.

I like 2/3's pheasant tail, and 1/3 dubbing to match the dry; all as a parachute fly, similar to a klinkhamer.

Emergers are good because part of the hook is in the water, which has a better hook up rate -- IMO.

Use them during any hatch.

 

[troutslammer]

fish size 12-18 depending on time of year , later the bugs are smaller , if drakes are hatching , a drake emerger , if sulfurs are hatching , a slufur emerger , if blue wing olives are hatching , bwo emerger , or caddis in oct especially or anytime , or u can fish the gray emerger which covers alot of bugs , its just another phase to fish during the cycle , best way to figure out what works is tie some or buy some and try em at different times and different depths

 

[shipnfish2006]

I tie the majority of my emergers like MKern, but I also like to use cripple patterns which are essentially the same thing except the hackle is tied catskill style. I've found that the best times to use them are right at the beginning of the hatch during the evening and also as the hatch has been around for a length of time in days, I'll use emergers pratically the entire evening because the trout has already seen almost every dry pattern in the book. Especially in streams like the SCPA limestoners.

 

[David]

I agree, l8xo, that emergers can be very important, but only on certain occasions. If you know what is hatching, have unsuccessfully tried dries (or limited success), and still see risers...the appropriate emerger will likely get a bunch for you.

I agree with MKern, but more for motion than fiber optics. Why is antron the shuck of choice. I use marabou for mine to give it that wiggle effect of an insect trying to escape. Antron just seems too stiff for that purpose.
For those who use antron, what is the rationale? Am I overlooking something in the material? Am I overlooking something in the naturals?

 

[afishinado]

David wrote:
I agree, l8xo, that emergers can be very important, but only on certain occasions. If you know what is hatching, have unsuccessfully tried dries (or limited success), and still see risers...the appropriate emerger will likely get a bunch for you.

[color=CC0000]I agree with MKern, but more for motion than fiber optics. Why is antron the shuck of choice. I use marabou for mine to give it that wiggle effect of an insect trying to escape. Antron just seems too stiff for that purpose.[/color]
For those who use antron, what is the rationale? Am I overlooking something in the material? Am I overlooking something in the naturals?

I agree 100%. Just put a fine mesh net in the water during a hatch to collect the shucks floating down and check them out. The are thin a flexible, and not shiny. And I'll add that antron adds buoyancy to the rear of the fly, marabou doesn’t. I like when my emerger rides butt down in the water.

 

[Fishidiot]

What David and Afishinado said...

I've used marabou for years for some emerger patterns and agree it adds to the movement effect, esp for mayflies. One thing I'd like to try this year is marabou for much smaller midge emergers as midges exhibit a great deal of wiggling movement when moving up thru the water column. I think the toughest aspect of tying emerger patterns is getting ones that actually function on the surface the way an insect emerges. Getting a fly to float on top, while simulataneosly hanging the back side of the fly down beneath the surface is tricky. I've tried a fair number of techniques (like many of you) to try to get this effect with pretty mixed results - foam, floatant, etc. This has been, at least for me, one of the great challenges of fly tying and fly design.

 

[jayL]

I am going to have to side with the antron team here.

I too am convinced by lafontaine's work, and all of my antron patterns consistently outperform my non-antron patterns. Flybop and I talked about it extensively, and even used patterns of nothing more than peacock herl and antron to fish the caddis on the horn. It was the only fly they'd touch.

It floats well, and I think it looks good in the water. It may not be perfectly imitative, but in my experience, it is a very consistent "trigger". Give it another shot. I have found that it improves the fishability of almost any pattern.

 

[pcray1231]

I use emergers fairly often. For caddis, which is perhaps when I use them the most, I use something similar to what flybop posted.

For sulphurs I'm with Mkern, I like the pheasant tail body with a little dubbing and puft of wing up front. I tend to run into spinner falls more on mayflies, but when I do run into hatching behavior, it is truly deadly.

 

[fritz]

I've used a liitle piece of black nylon stocking for a hendrickson shuck--hang it off the hook. Antron works too.

 

[Acristickid]

Emergers are important but never really do that well fishing that tactic. Need more practice.

If they are taking emergers- would prefer to fish wet flies. But usually when I see fish taking them it is in water that is not conducive to wet fly fishing.

The one that is burned in my memory is fishing a sulpher hatch on Penns waiting for the GD hatch. The fish were totally keyed into the sulpher emergers- I could not buy a strike.

 

[govtmule]

a parachute is considered an emerger...also a comparadun with an antron shuck is an emerger....There are substages to an emerger, i think fishing a "dry" that is flush on the film is the last stage of an emerger....(i like this the best)....fish wets and unweighted nymphs for the emerger stages throughout the water column. Most "experts" agree that using a wet fly a size bigger doesnt matter too much, its the ascent of the bug to the surface that triggers a strike, so have a bunch of different wet flies colors, sizes to accomplish this...that's one thing i'm going to have more of in my box.

jeff

 

[afishinado]

jayL wrote:
I am going to have to side with the antron team here.

[color=CC0000]I too am convinced by lafontaine's work, and all of my antron patterns consistently outperform my non-antron patterns. [/color] Flybop and I talked about it extensively, and even used patterns of nothing more than peacock herl and antron to fish the caddis on the horn. It was the only fly they'd touch.

It floats well, and I think it looks good in the water. It may not be perfectly imitative, but in my experience, it is a very consistent "trigger". Give it another shot. I have found that it improves the fishability of almost any pattern.

Jay,

I'm a huge LaFountaine disciple. I own many of his books, fish many of his patterns, and subscribe to his theories on attraction with fly patterns.

He primarily used antron on his caddisfly fly bodies because the fiber emitted air bubbles like a caddis pupa.

The following is his primary mayfly emerger pattern, the halo mayfly emerger. Notice he uses marabou as the shuck.



http://www.thebookmailer.com/Flies/Emergers/halomayflyemerger.html

My study of his writings and patterns is what actually led me to the conclusion that marabou makes a more effective shuck than antron. Actually, a small strip of a woman’s nylon stocking is probably the most realistic shuck I’ve seen. But that’s another story altogether.

I'm not saying don't use antron in your flies, jsut not for the shuck.

 

[flybop]

The theory and LaFontain's rational behind his use of Antron is about as controversial a subject that you can bring up amoung guys who are into entomology. At the center of this debate, and what Gary says is the reason for Antron, is that many insects encapsulate themselves in a gaseous bubble that helps them float or swim to the surface. After literally years of actual underwater study with scuba gear Gary found Antron and used it to imitate the shine or glimmer of this bubble.

Most of this study was on caddis, and the result was Gary's emergant sparkle pupa. The pattern in my post is just one that I came up with while tweaking Gar'y sparkle pupa. The Antron in that pattern is there to create that shimmer of the ascending insect's gas bubble, not movement. All I can say about that pattern is that when I began to fish it in Pa during pre-hatch, and even into hatches, periods my catch rate sky rocketed. Tied for the different may flies in Pa this simple emerger has been a killer for me.

 

[pete41]

delete

 

[jayL]

afishinado wrote:

jayL wrote:
I am going to have to side with the antron team here.

[color=CC0000]I too am convinced by lafontaine's work, and all of my antron patterns consistently outperform my non-antron patterns. [/color] Flybop and I talked about it extensively, and even used patterns of nothing more than peacock herl and antron to fish the caddis on the horn. It was the only fly they'd touch.

It floats well, and I think it looks good in the water. It may not be perfectly imitative, but in my experience, it is a very consistent "trigger". Give it another shot. I have found that it improves the fishability of almost any pattern.

Jay,

I'm a huge LaFountaine disciple. I own many of his books, fish many of his patterns, and subscribe to his theories on attraction with fly patterns.

He primarily used antron on his caddisfly fly bodies because the fiber emitted air bubbles like a caddis pupa.

The following is his primary mayfly emerger pattern, the halo mayfly emerger. Notice he uses marabou as the shuck.



http://www.thebookmailer.com/Flies/Emergers/halomayflyemerger.html

My study of his writings and patterns is what actually led me to the conclusion that marabou makes a more effective shuck than antron. Actually, a small strip of a woman’s nylon stocking is probably the most realistic shuck I’ve seen. But that’s another story altogether.

I'm not saying don't use antron in your flies, jsut not for the shuck.

Tom,

I should have clarified that I was primarily talking about caddis. My mayfly emergers mainly consist of soft hackles, winged wets, parachutes (klinks and traditionals), and greased nymphs. I have some with an antron shuck, but haven't found them to be that amazing. I will give the marabou emerger a try for mayflies.

Antron shines as a shell or wing material for me in caddis patterns.

 

[afishinado]

Flybop,

That fly looks and is tied a lot like a LaFountaine diving caddis:

http://www.thebookmailer.com/Flies/WetFlies/divingcaddis.html

http://www.westfly.com/fly-pattern-recipe/wet/divingcaddis.shtml


It is a great pattern. I use it quite often. I also use a caddis pattern, the CDC & Elk, with great success for mayfly emergers.

What I posted earlier was that I use marabou or a little combed out wool yarn instead of the antron shuck that many standard emerger patterns call for. The marabou or yarn has more of a tendency to sink making the fly ride butt down in the column. I also has more movement in the water.

 

[flybop]

Afish, more likely than not that is what the fly in my post is. I first tied and used that pattern over 15 years ago and have been tying them from memory since. Don't get me wrong, I tie plenty of emergers with soft, movement oriented tails.

Come to think of it, baetis (bwo's) are also divers. Both the egg laying female as well as many males dive or swim below the surface.

Speaking of shucks, have any of you used those plastic formed shucks?

 

[jayL]

I have had days on spring creek where adult BWOs were sitting clinging to my leg under water. It was weird.