mayfly question

flipnfly

flipnfly

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im sitting here contemplating on what to tie for the jam and i was wondering are mayfly nymphs and emergers bigger than the dry?
 
I guess if they emerge from within they must be a little. At least at first. I usually just tie them the same size. But what do I know. The question is which species to tie.
 
Flipnfly.............i think , like TomG , they'd have to be a little bigger , just 'cause of the fact they are breaking out of their old body , i'd not change the fly size though , i don't think the change is that much to warrant a bigger hook size , in fact in order to help with floating i keep the dry fly version of everything on as small and fine a hook size as i can get away with , simple , less weight , longer float time.
 
I tie my nymphs a size bigger in many cases. For emergers, I'll go anywhere from two sizes larger to a size smaller. It depends on the species and whether it requires a shuck. Some patterns like some sulphur emergers, I basically tie half nymph, half dun on a +2 sized hook.
 
early season nymphs = bigger , late season nymphs = smaller , just like the duns you see , but keep in mind in my opinion (which doesn't matter much ) trout feel more comfortable eating a smaller nymph , i think they see alot more smaller nymphs than they do big ones (midges for example , small bacteria etc)
 
TS, the question was whether there was a size difference between a nymph and adult of the same insect.

I am not sure I even agree with your answer if it was the question though. Guys have been fishing small quills and soon MBs and Drakes will come...look at the fly size column in this hatch chart compared to the dates.

http://www.orvis.com/intro.aspx?dir_id=758&subject=254&bhcp=1
 
Make sure of the tails are the right size, nymphs short, emergers short, duns long and spinners twice as long.
 
tom , are the first sulfurs to show bigger or smaller than the later ones ? , are the first BWO to show bigger or smaller than the later ones ? do the grannom caddis start out a size 14 and end in a size 18 , all of this hold true on my homewaters but maybe not where your at , obviously u try to match the size nymph with the natural , but bugs do get smaller arround here the later in the season , the bugs coming off thanksgiving day are not a 12 , i can tell you that !
 
Its more of a roller coaster. Its not big then little. You don;t list where you're from so I don't know what your home waters are. Regardless, its not as black and white as you said and there isn't much hatching in November.
 
some streams there isn't much hatching in may either , last year on oil creek in november , size18 cinnamon caddis , size 18 tan caddis , size 22 BWO , black midges , tan midges , grey midges , fish were rising steady in the afternoon , i was saying generally speaking that the flys get smaller as the year progresses , and i said my homewaters cause we don't have good green drake hatches or hex hatches so there is no roller coaster effect
 
Midges and caddis aren't mayflies and have no nymphal stage, so they really don't apply to the conversation.

Mayflies go through an incomplete metamorphosis (egg, nymph, adult)and caddis and midges a complete metamorphosis (egg, larvae, pupa, adult).

With that said, go back and read the question. It was referring to the Jam...meaning waters in and around Coburn. You advice might as well have been about waters in Florida. Point is they don't are inaccurate.
 
i would do what tom says , sulfurs will probably be coming off in and arround coburn that day (invaria , rotunda ) size 12 & 14 so i would tie a pheasant tail in a size 12 or 14 to immitate them , don't go smaller cause they don't work any better , most sulfur nymphs u see under rocks are a size 12 i guess , and when the dorothea come off later in the year still use that same size 12 PT even though the dorotheas are a size 18 , should work well for ya , oh and one other thing all sulfur nymphs are not only the same size all year like tom said , they are all the same color too , imagine that !
 
troutslammer wrote:
i would do what tom says , sulfurs will probably be coming off in and arround coburn that day (invaria , rotunda ) size 12 & 14 so i would tie a pheasant tail in a size 12 or 14 to immitate them , don't go smaller cause they don't work any better , most sulfur nymphs u see under rocks are a size 12 i guess , and when the dorothea come off later in the year still use that same size 12 PT even though the dorotheas are a size 18 , should work well for ya , oh and one other thing all sulfur nymphs are not only the same size all year like tom said , they are all the same color too , imagine that !

I don't remember saying any of those things...actually until I realized you last post was meant to intentionally give bad advice I was going to correct you about the size of the sulfurs. They were closer to a 16 the last Jam I attended in Coburn. With hatches as off schedule as they seem to be this year, however, I'd keep checking the reports from the Feathered Hook.
 
tom i was just busting your balls a bit , having fun , flip since we fished together and you gave me flys that worked down at neshanock creek for the grannoms that day the water was crystal clear and fish were pressured hard , here is my recommendation , now i am no expert but in my opinion , here it is , i would match the nymph to the dun (natural) or i usually go one size smaller , what to tie for the jamb , grey fox size 14 , sulphur size 16 , light cahill size 14 , coffin fly spinner size 12 (3xL) , tan caddis size 16 , slate drake size 14 , green caddis size 16 , not sure which ones will be on the water or maybe all of them or maybe none of them but this list might get you prepared
 
flipnfly,

Yes, mayfly nymphs are a bit bigger than the duns. To get the proper proportions idea, take a look at a standard dry fly hook compared to a standard nymph hook of the same size. You'll see that the nymph hook shank is a bit longer than the dry fly hook shank for this reason.

Emerger size will depend on what stage of the emergence you are fishing. For example, duns half way out of the shuck will be bigger than a dun just breaking through the shuck. Many times you can get away with the same size as the dun for the emerger, just add a longer tail/shuck.

Good luck.
 
ok ok no fighting thanks for all the advice i was just confused because i have read somewhere that nymphs were a full hook size bigger than the adult and as soon as i come across it ill post the referance maybe thats why my nymphing with an indicator has been so mediocre at its best this goes to show even the pro's get it wrong sometimes and even publish it hey if anyone wants to go fishing any saturday after mothers day let me know im always up for fishing with anyone and almost anywhere except still water i find it boring
 
troutslammer wrote:
tom i was just busting your balls a bit ,

ditto...wondered when you'd come around...thought you were gonna go LJ on me.
 
tom i never messed with ya before so i figured it was your turn to be on your toes ,,,,lmao
 
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