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Whip finishing small flies

Joined:
2006/9/12 12:26
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Hi guys. I have been tying a bunch of size 28 BWOs with a foam post. I have no problems tying the actual fly, but when I go to whip finish is where the problem is. I tie the hackle on parachute style around the post and then whip finish. It is really hard to get under it and whip finish in general on such a small fly. Often the thread will slip off the hook while whip finishing and then my hackle will come off. I do sometimes tie a half hitch before whip finishing to hold it on.

Any tips/tricks? I have been using Mustad Signature R50 Dry/Wet Standard size 28.

BJ

Posted on: 2006/12/8 13:01


Re: Whip finishing small flies
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From Monessen, PA
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I learned this tip here some time ago. After adding your tailing material, dubbing the body and securing the post, when preparing to hackle parachute-style, turn the hook vertically in the vice with the eye pointing straight down and the post out at a right angle. Then, just hackle the post as if it were the hook (except you would want to turn the hackle down the post toward the hook) and then secure the hackle and do your whip-finish at the bottom of the post, rather than along the hook shaft.

I hope that makes sense.

Posted on: 2006/12/8 13:17
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Re: Whip finishing small flies

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Wow, great idea! My only question would be how to keep the thread from flying off the hook, but I would guess a half hitch.

BJ

Posted on: 2006/12/8 13:22
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Re: Whip finishing small flies
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I expanded my instruction above. to answer your question, you could whip or half hitch the thread prior to turning the hook or, just move the thread to behind the post (toward the tail), so that when you turn the fly in the jaws, it will be hanging over the post and ready to secure the hackle as desribed.

Posted on: 2006/12/8 13:25
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Re: Whip finishing small flies

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2006/9/14 10:34
From Southeast PA
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I definitely would start with a half hitch (one wrap around the hackle to hold it, and then a half hitch). This way if the thread slips off during whip finishing you won't have to rewind the hackle .

Do you think using a smaller diameter thread might help?

Posted on: 2006/12/8 14:36


Re: Whip finishing small flies

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2006/9/11 13:05
From Lewistown
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Two "Fly Fisherman" ago the man who invented the klinkhamer explained how he hackled parachutes. It involves the method Jack stated -- turning the eye of the hook down and positioning the fly verticle. instead of half-hitching, he finished (using the whip finish) the fly without wrapping the hackle. Then he turned the hook (no need to worry about thread and materials coming unwound) and started the thread at the base of the parachute post, wrapped the hackle (from top to bottom, and not bottom up) and whip finished the fly around the parachute. The author mentioned that the fly is more durable because the fish's teeth can't catch the quill of the hackle and strip it out.
However, I am to lasy for this and use 8/0 of 10/0 thread and save a lot of room at the eye. I can manage to save room by starting my thread mid-shank and not at the eye. It may only be a wrap or two, but it works for me and I tie a lot of parachutes. i don't know if you do this already, but this is how I tie a parachuted fly: Start at the mid of the shank and wrap back. Then ad the tails. Wrap all the way back to where I am going to place the chute, and tie it in (I don't use a thread dam, but wrap around the base w/ 3-4 wraps). Then, I tie my hackle in straight up w/ the dull side facing me. Wrap the back, and dub the entire fly. Wrap the hackle (counter-clockwise - allos the thread to push the fibers out of the way without being trapped under the thread)and whip finish.
Another thing I just thought of was if you are having trouble securing the hackle. Give 3 wraps of thread over the quill and tug fairly tight. This gives you some playing room without having the hackle unwind.

Posted on: 2006/12/8 14:55
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Re: Whip finishing small flies

Joined:
2006/9/9 9:38
From W Pa
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Hi
How about whip finishing with a ball point pen, that's how I whip finish my small flies. Just go around the pen three times and put it over eye.

JaD

Posted on: 2007/1/9 22:32
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Re: Whip finishing small flies
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2006/9/11 8:26
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For a long time, I’ve been tying parachutes using the method of finishing the fly without winding the hackle and turning it 90* to finish. It works well, especially for small flies. Two things also help. First, I use “Ultra Midge” tying thread. Many brands labeled 12/0 – 14/0 – 16/0, but aren’t that small of a diameter since diameter rating on thread is not standardized. Ultra Midge is ultra thin. It comes only in white. I use a permanent marker to color if necessary. The thin thread adds almost no bulk to the fly and works great to tie off your hackle on the post. Secondly, I use a Matarelli type whip finisher to tie off my flies. It allows precise placement of the wraps and gives a good whip finish.

Good luck with your #28’s. I have a lot of midge patterns down to size #30 on my list to tie this winter, but between the good weather on weekends for fishing, and the Eagles playoff games, I haven’t tied much at all. Go Birds!

Posted on: 2007/1/10 10:00


Re: Whip finishing small flies
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2006/9/9 19:16
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Quote:

JAD wrote:
Hi
How about whip finishing with a ball point pen, that's how I whip finish my small flies. Just go around the pen three times and put it over eye.

JaD



Thats a half hitch...

Posted on: 2007/1/10 10:31
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Re: Whip finishing small flies

Joined:
2007/1/2 11:55
From Bozeman
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Maurice,

I think you could tie a whip onto a pen or half hitch tool and slide it onto the hook, couldn't you?

I think that's what he means.

Posted on: 2007/1/10 11:20


Re: Whip finishing small flies

Joined:
2006/9/21 0:02
From Pittsburgh
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I've never tied a parachute that small, but I guess that would be a problem.
As the other guys suggested, I would probably just throw a few half hitches on and a tiny drop of glue. Also finer thread will help things - I bought a spool of 12-ott thread a few years ago and it's great for tiny flies

Posted on: 2007/1/11 13:52


Re: Whip finishing small flies

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2006/9/11 13:05
From Lewistown
Posts: 3623
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If you want great small sized thread. E Hille's has a product from a man named Roman Moser. He has this thread called power silk. In 12/0 it is vurtually unbreakable with human hands. Matter of fact, my scissors have a hard time cutting through it on the first try (xacto knife instead).

Posted on: 2007/1/11 17:35
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Re: Whip finishing small flies
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Quote:

MKern wrote:
Matter of fact, my scissors have a hard time cutting through it on the first try (xacto knife instead).


Time for a new pair of scissors, I would say.

Posted on: 2007/1/11 17:48
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Re: Whip finishing small flies

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2006/9/11 13:05
From Lewistown
Posts: 3623
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Jack,
My scissors are still good (or atleast they have no problem cutting through anything else). This thread is so stong, that when I was tying last night, the 12/0 thread was cutting my .20 lead wire like it was butter, and I wasn't even applying a whole lot of tension.

Posted on: 2007/1/12 10:20
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><(Mkern{( ‘ >






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