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Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2015/7/7 21:25
From Butler Co
Posts: 82
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I bought some size 16 dry fly hooks online this week and they arrived yesterday. I had studied the pictures online and the gap seemed appropriate so I bought them. However they ended up being a narrow gap and when I compared them against my Mustad 94840 the difference was apparent. The 94840's were much wider.

I'm curious if anyone has tried to determine if the gap really makes that big of a difference in hookup rates. I've always felt a wider gap was superior but I've never tried to quantify it, by tracking percent missed. Do you miss twice as many or maybe just 10%. Any insight on this?


Posted on: 10/22 11:51


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

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2006/9/21 0:02
From Pittsburgh
Posts: 628
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I think wide gap hooks can make a difference - especially in smaller sizes. IMO, that's from #18 on down. #16 and larger, I kinda doubt that it makes much difference. But it wouldn't hurt to use wide gap in larger size hooks for sure.

As for percentage of hookup rates - I can't really even guess.
I still manage to miss fish on both regular and wide gap hooks - in all sizes.
I do know that when I first started to fish trico hatches - many years ago now - I used standard #24 mustard 94840 hooks. Which pretty much were all that was available then. They had a very narrow hook gap. And I missed lots of strikes on them.
When wider gap hooks became available in those smaller sizes - I switched over. And noticed an increase in my hookup rates

Posted on: 10/22 14:03


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2015/7/7 21:25
From Butler Co
Posts: 82
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In size 16 if the 94840 are considered narrow then these new hooks are even worse. I'll try them out anyone since I'm already invested.

Thanks for the feedback

Posted on: 10/23 0:55


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks
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2016/1/24 14:30
From Gettysburg
Posts: 1923
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Quote:

dryflyguy wrote:
I think wide gap hooks can make a difference - especially in smaller sizes. IMO, that's from #18 on down. #16 and larger, I kinda doubt that it makes much difference.


This has also been my experience.

Posted on: 10/23 7:48


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2014/8/2 20:20
From Mechanicsburg
Posts: 428
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Same here. I don't think wide gape looks really matter until you get below sz18. With dries, I find that sometimes I have to adjust how I time my lift/line tightening, depending on how fast or slow they're taking them.

If you are looking for wide gape dry fly hooks in small sizes, Henry Ramsey sells Varivas hooks.

Posted on: 10/23 9:58


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2006/9/13 18:28
From chester ct
Posts: 250
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For #22 and down, I use a lot of the Orvis Big-Eyes, and with these (actually any small hook) I kirb or offset the barb 10-20 degrees. This helps my hookup and hold rates. Now that I think of it, this offsetting does increase the gap, if you measure from hookpoint to the shank.

I've been playing with light wire shrimp hooks too. Some of these are already offset.

Posted on: 10/23 11:08
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Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks
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2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
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TMC 2487's are great for tying small dries, I use them all the time. They're 2x wide, 2x short and fine wire. As an example, a size 20 2487 would have a gape of a size 18 hook (2x wide) and the shank length of a size 22 hook (2x short). Therefore you are tying a fly the length of a size 22 and getting the bite of a size 18 hook.

TMC 2487

Posted on: 10/23 14:09


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

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2010/8/4 11:18
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+1 for the 2487s

Posted on: 10/23 18:18


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

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2006/9/10 21:53
From Greensburg, PA
Posts: 412
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are we blaming misses on the hooks again.. . :)

Posted on: 10/23 19:49


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2008/1/21 13:28
From South Central PA
Posts: 102
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if you are talking about name brand dry fly competition hooks, the wide gap helps compensate for the curved in point. I am fairly sure that among barbless designs they hold on to fish better. As to the OP report that his sample was actually more narrow strikes me as unusual as well as undesirable. And like others have mentioned, the TMC 2487 is remarkable for small fly applications.

Posted on: 10/26 12:52


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2006/9/13 10:18
From LV
Posts: 595
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It's very dependent on the size of the hook you are using. A wide gap on small hooks may give you more caught and landed fish then a standard hook. When hooks get really small it's very important. On # 18 or larger not so much.

Posted on: 10/27 20:23
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Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2010/6/23 12:43
From Hershey
Posts: 137
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I believe the wide gap does help some. My favorite fly I tie on a 200R or similar natural bend hook. I'd love to find a 2X or 3X natural bend hook that didn't have a teeny hook gap. No tout there that I have found.
Hook gap seems to be a bigger factor than barbed.

Posted on: 10/29 8:08


Re: Hookup rates of wide gap dry fly hooks

Joined:
2009/11/5 1:46
Posts: 228
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Quote:

troutpoop wrote:
I believe the wide gap does help some. My favorite fly I tie on a 200R or similar natural bend hook. I'd love to find a 2X or 3X natural bend hook that didn't have a teeny hook gap.


So use a standard gape hook that's 2x or 3x larger.

The concept of "wide gape" is modern marketing ploy, and is pretty meaningless. Traditionally, hook sizes are based based on the gape, the legnth varies. For example, a size 10 streamer hook has the same gape as a size 10 dry fly hook, but the former may be 4x long -- i.e. the length of a hook with a size 6 gape.

For some reason, there's a certain mind set that tiny hooks are better, so rather than sell a size 18 2x short hook, some manufacturers started calling it a size 20 "2x wide gape." That way, you can say you caught a large fish on a size 20 hook. You didn't, and the whole concept undermines the traditional understanding of hook size.

Here's an explanation of hook shank length that I grabbed off the web:
Quote:


Shank: The shank is the part of the hook from behind the eye to the beginning of the bend, which is usually directly above the space between the point and the barb. Standard shank length is defined as the distance of twice the Gape plus the width of the eye. An "x" system designates longer or shorter than standard lengths. Each "x" represents one hook size, so a size 6, 2x long (2XL) has a shank length of a standard size 4 hook. A size 6, 2x short (2XS) would have a shank length of a standard size 8 hook. Almost all fly hooks are even-numbered only, however, the "x" designation is determined by individual digit sizes. The shank can be straight or curved.

Posted on: 10/29 9:57
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