Register now on PaFlyFish.com! Login
HOME FORUM BLOG PHOTOS LINKS


Sponsors

Browsing this Thread:   1 Anonymous Users



(1) 2 »


Upper Delaware River Flow
Moderator
Joined:
2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
Posts: 2113
Offline
From the Delaware River Club report this morning:

The Cannonsville release was dropped to 225 yesterday. This morning it was brought up to 240 cfs. The low water and bright sun spiked the water temperatures on the lower West Branch and Mainstem.

Definitely check the water temperatures today before you fish the West and we should avoid trout fishing on the Main altogether. Unfortunately this situation seems like total unnecessary political posturing as the decree parties try to come to a flow agreement. While we’d love to see an agreement signed that is mutually beneficial to all river users, putting the downstream ecosystem in peril to prove a point seems reckless and spiteful. The current storage for the NYC Reservoir System is 84.4%. Normal storage for September 18th is 76.6%.
Please let the principles know that protecting the river ecosystem is much more important than some political posturing / power play:

Here’s the contact information for the 1954 U.S. Supreme Court Decree Party Principals/Designees :

Paul Rush (NYC): prush@dep.nyc.gov 845-334-7107
Mark Klotz (NY): mark.klotz@dec.ny.gov 518-402-8233
Jennifer Orr (PA): jeorr@pa.gov 717-772-5633
Dan Kennedy (NJ): dan.kennedy@dep.nj.gov 609-292-4543
David Wunsch (DE): dwunsch@udel.edu 302-831-8258


Link to source: http://thedelawareriverclub.com/blog/

Posted on: 9/20 6:42


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2014/3/23 20:12
Posts: 192
Offline
Well, that just sucks.

In addition to less cool water from Cannonsville, exacerbating the thermal problems: lower river levels = more exposed rocks = more heating from sunlight.

The moderate air temps are somewhat helpful, but the abundant sunshine is definitely harmful.

There is precious little rain in the 10 day forecast, combined with highs in the low 80s over the weekend: https://www.wunderground.com/forecast/us/pa/starlight/18461

Given the reservoir levels afish noted, it's hard to not view this as using the river as a lever to get a deal done. Sad.


Posted on: 9/20 8:16


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2014/6/18 20:59
Posts: 1631
Offline
I've spoken to 2 different decree party offices in the last month. PA DCNR actually called me back which I found shocking. PA left a voicemail that they are working on finalizing the flow agreement and won't disclose any information at this time. An official press release will come once signed by all parties. NYC spoke to me for nearly 30 minutes regarding the matter, development in the Catskills, etc. They absolutely admit to using the flow as a 'gun to the head' in order to get the agreement signed. Again, it is PA holding up the process this time. They also understand the need of cold water and specific flows in order to protect the fishery. They had fairly generous and very consistent releases since June to help protect things over the summer. Lastly, the entire thing started with NJ wanting more water in the river so they could use more for drinking supplies. NYC said that the new flow agreement will do that and they think the fishermen / conservationists will find the new multi-year agreement ......very good.


Low flows, semi-warm nights and mid June highs will cook the river in just a day or two. The only saving grace....trees still have leaves and sun angle is much lower than June. Cool weather just around the corner. Hopefully they all sign and get it flowing again soon.

I think they could release 1500-2000 cfs from each lake until October 30th and still be above the winter pool target. Oh well

Posted on: 9/20 17:54
_________________
Deadbeat Hero


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow
Moderator
Joined:
2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
Posts: 2113
Offline
Quote:

krayfish2 wrote:
I've spoken to 2 different decree party offices in the last month. PA DCNR actually called me back which I found shocking. PA left a voicemail that they are working on finalizing the flow agreement and won't disclose any information at this time. An official press release will come once signed by all parties. NYC spoke to me for nearly 30 minutes regarding the matter, development in the Catskills, etc. They absolutely admit to using the flow as a 'gun to the head' in order to get the agreement signed. Again, it is PA holding up the process this time. They also understand the need of cold water and specific flows in order to protect the fishery. They had fairly generous and very consistent releases since June to help protect things over the summer. Lastly, the entire thing started with NJ wanting more water in the river so they could use more for drinking supplies. NYC said that the new flow agreement will do that and they think the fishermen / conservationists will find the new multi-year agreement ......very good.


Low flows, semi-warm nights and mid June highs will cook the river in just a day or two. The only saving grace....trees still have leaves and sun angle is much lower than June. Cool weather just around the corner. Hopefully they all sign and get it flowing again soon.

I think they could release 1500-2000 cfs from each lake until October 30th and still be above the winter pool target. Oh well


Putting your fishin' pole where your mouth is.....or sumthin' like that

How many guys would take to time to actually call the parties involved to find out what is going on and to prod them in the right direction. A lotta respect for your efforts K-fish.

It good to hear that things are moving and the issue may be resolved soon, and favorably (for the fish and fishermen).

Thanks again for your update and your efforts.

Posted on: 9/21 6:30


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2012/2/16 18:55
From Nowheresville, PA
Posts: 1330
Offline
It will be interesting to see how the radio tagged fish behave during low flows. Will they hunker down on the bottom or will they move? They have been shown to move many miles in past studies. The UD fish are a special breed.

We participated in tagging some of the trout this past summer on the upper west. Interesting to see how it is done.

Posted on: 9/21 6:47
_________________
“USED TROUT STREAM FOR SALE.
MUST BE SEEN TO BE APPRECIATED.”


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2014/6/18 20:59
Posts: 1631
Offline
Fish tagged this summer? Please share more info, link and / or photos.

Posted on: 9/21 14:22
_________________
Deadbeat Hero


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2014/6/18 20:59
Posts: 1631
Offline
Last update from FUDR email:

The five Decree Parties have scheduled a meeting of the Delaware River Basin Commission-Regulated Flow Advisory Committee (RFAC) on September 28, 2017 from 1:00-4:00 p.m. at the West Trenton Volunteer Fire Company Hall, 40 West Upper Ferry Road, West Trenton NJ.

Indications are they are very close to a new long term agreement for the management of the NYC Delaware River basin reservoirs and it sounds like they are prepared to share the high points of that plan at the RFAC meeting.

Posted on: 9/21 14:23
_________________
Deadbeat Hero


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2012/2/16 18:55
From Nowheresville, PA
Posts: 1330
Offline
Sounds hopeful!

My son and I fished with a guide one day on upper west and any fish caught were "tagged"....actually a small incision was made and a chip was placed in fish. i think the study is being done by PA and Ny together. Another day I was up at balls eddy and got to watch them shocking from a boat as well. same deal with the implanting the micro chip. the study will show fish movements in the system.
Apparently a similar study was done a while back. really fascinating stuff. I look forward to learning more. We even know the exact fish we caught (numbering system) and it may be possible to see where they turn up.

I have some pics and video of some of it but I give up trying to load on this site.

Just found this-- Here is Ben Rinker scanning and tagging fish-

https://www.compleatangleronline.com/b ... pper-delaware-river-trout

Posted on: 9/21 14:42

Edited by foxtrapper1972 on 2017/9/21 14:58:24
_________________
“USED TROUT STREAM FOR SALE.
MUST BE SEEN TO BE APPRECIATED.”


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2010/8/31 15:00
From Lehigh Valley PA
Posts: 45
Offline
WBA guides were doing this this as well. Interesting stuff

Posted on: 9/21 15:21


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2010/2/18 8:57
From SW PA
Posts: 171
Offline
Stilesville is back up to 756 CFS. Montague gage is 1720CFS and falling.
Hate to be waist deep when the flow jumps 400CFS.

Hope this FFMP stuff gets resolved.

Posted on: 9/21 19:22
_________________
Hatches come and go of their own accord, but work will wait for you to get back.


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2014/6/18 20:59
Posts: 1631
Offline
I had no idea there was another tagging study being done. Very cool that a select group of guides are involved. Can't wait to see the data this one produces. I think we'll see the same fish show up at Hale and in Hankins which shows the extent of their yearly movements. There will also be fish that don't move 300 yard in 3 years.

As far as the flows, you know the story.....you go and hope for the best. You'll never get it but there's always hope. Based on the parties holding a meeting on the 28th, I'm guessing the plan has been agreed to and signed by all parties. They will unveil it and field questions. NYC rep told me it was much more favorable to fish AND anglers than prior plans. Guess we'll know next week. Keep it flowing!!


Posted on: 9/22 9:53
_________________
Deadbeat Hero


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2013/1/13 20:57
From Bucks Cty
Posts: 6
Offline
I was shocked to see how low it was fishing at Bulls Island. Talked to guys who know the river well saying they hit rocks. It's is really dangerous now. I ended up hitting one when returning that evening.

Posted on: 9/23 8:40


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow

Joined:
2011/4/6 12:53
From Northwest NJ
Posts: 8
Offline
Anyone have any news from this Thursday's public meeting? Are the 5 parties any closer to an agreement?

Posted on: 9/30 9:25


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow
Moderator
Joined:
2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
Posts: 2113
Offline
Here is the latest info about the status of a new Upper Delaware flow agreement from the FUDR site:

Closing in on a New Delaware River Reservoir Plan

In response to heavy public pressure, the 1954 Supreme Court Decree Parties convened last week in Trenton, NJ to provide the public with a status update on the next plan for the management of the NYC Delaware River basin reservoirs.

It appears as if the Decree Parties are very close to a new long term (10 year) management plan for the reservoirs. While nothing has been finalized and negotiations are ongoing, here’s what we learned from their presentation with respect to the impacts on the Upper Delaware River:

The new plan closely resembles the former FFMP structure and approach in many ways and includes the ability to be adaptive as new information and data becomes available that supports modifications and course corrections.

The parties have agreed to the creation of a thermal relief bank that can address dangerous periods of high air and water temperatures in the coldwater system of the upper river.

The parties have agreed to a bank of water set aside to eliminate the devastating impacts of erratic “yo-yo” water releases that rapidly dewater the river, pose long term threats to aquatic habitat, and disrupt recreational opportunities that are so important to the local economy of the UDR region.

There are indications that management decisions about the use of the water in the thermal and “yo-yo” banks may be streamlined in a way that avoids the cumbersome process of gathering unanimous approval from all five parties.

According to recent DRBC modeling, the new plan will keep water releases in the higher release tables for longer periods of time throughout the year, which means more water for the river.

The East Branch and Neversink rivers receive modest increases in baseline conservation releases that will help protect and improve the health of both of those systems.

The parties have agreed to cooperatively study several unaddressed issues that are critically important to the upper river and maintain enough flexibility in the plan to incorporate changes as they are agreed upon. These issues include protection of the Dwarf Wedge Mussel and examining how the bank of water (IERQ) reserved for multiple downstream needs is calculated.

There are positive indications from all of the parties regarding an increased willingness to create more opportunities for public participation and engagement as the unaddressed issues are prepared for incorporation into the 10 year plan.

Our initial take on the plan:

The new plan fails to reflect the true amount of water we believe is available most of the time in the Delaware system that could be used to significantly improve/increase baseline conservation releases from the Delaware reservoirs. This continues to be an enormous shortcoming in reservoir management and often cripples the ability of the Upper Delaware River to achieve it’s maximum ecological and economic potential.

It’s tremendous news that thermal issues and “yo-yo” impacts will be formally addressed in the new plan. For years, the UDR conservation community has made these two items a top priority in our annual “Fair Share” requests and we are very pleased that they will receive specific programmatic attention in the new plan.

The creation of the thermal and “yo yo” banks should provide the appropriate resource agencies (especially NYS and PA fisheries staff) with more flexibility and autonomy to make independent (and quicker) decisions about the use of those new banks while avoiding the need to corral all five parties every time the upper river needs water for these purposes.

It is frustrating that more study is required for some of the unaddressed issues. In part, this is an unfortunate byproduct of the negative dynamics among the parties over the last several years which has prevented good faith discussions and killed any semblance of collaborative spirit. Hopefully, agreement on this new plan creates a path for a more united and inclusive process that meets the needs of all stakeholders while protecting the economic and environmental qualities of the river system.

The enhanced opportunities for public engagement in plan implementation is an encouraging new development that the conservation community should seize upon.

Of Immediate Importance!

At the RFAC meeting, NYC informed the audience that they will stand by their plan to suspend their voluntary release program on October 10. That means dangerously low Revision 1 water releases will be back in play on that date.

At the moment, the releases from Cannonsville Reservoir are over 1000 cfs in order to meet the lower basin flow target at Montague, NJ. When the large directed release is no longer necessary, the upper river could receive another “yo-yo” shock in the absence of a new agreement or another temporary release plan.

It just so happens that October 11 is the date of the FUDR annual conference in Hancock, NY at the West Branch Angler and all of the Decree Party representatives will be in attendance. Please consider attending our conference and let your voice be heard during this critical period for the Upper Delaware River.


Link to source: http://www.fudr.org/2017/10/04/closin ... are-river-reservoir-plan/

Posted on: 10/5 8:49


Re: Upper Delaware River Flow
Moderator
Joined:
2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
Posts: 2113
Offline
Dey pulled da plug!

Hopefully the powers that be will get this thing straightened out and do what's right for the River and fish.

Stilesville Gauge

Attach file:



jpg  Stilesville Gauge.jpg (58.92 KB)
53_59da33e39810c.jpg 576X384 px

Posted on: 10/8 10:19



(1) 2 »



You can view topic.
You cannot start a new topic.
You cannot reply to posts.
You cannot edit your posts.
You cannot delete your posts.
You cannot add new polls.
You cannot vote in polls.
You cannot attach files to posts.
You cannot post without approval.

[Advanced Search]





Site Content
Login
Sponsors
Stay Connected

twitterfeed.com facebook instagram RSS Feed

USGS Water Levels
Polls
Angling Trade E-Survey: How Many Outdoor Print Magazines Do You Subscribe To?
None. Nada. Zip. 50% (46)
One or two. 32% (30)
Three or four. 13% (12)
More than four. 3% (3)
_PL_TOTALVOTES
The poll closed at 2017/10/27 11:42
Comments?





Copyright 2017 by PaFlyFish.com | Privacy Policy| Provided by Kile Media Group | Design by 7dana.com