Having given the issue some thought this morning......I think part of the debate comes down to what one accepts as "sea run." The traditional view and stricter definition of sea run, of course, implies a trout that is spawned in freshwater, migrates literally out to sea; lives in the ocean for years, and then migrates back up the river to spawn. In other words, the same as steelhead. To some degree, such a plan was proposed with the Manasquan fish as it was hoped these fish would go out to sea and return. Could such a population exist in the Delaware? Sure. My personal view is that they probably don't exist.....and I'll continue to be skeptical until I see something scientific and not anecdotal reports.

On the other hand, we all know that trout migrate long distances in PA warm water rivers on a seasonal basis. Shad and stripers, after all, migrate virtually the entire Delaware river length on a seasonal basis. It's certainly plausible that some browns that were spawned up in the NY section of the West Branch could, after the spawn, migrate downstream and lay up below Trenton for the winter and return in spring. Some might even be able to live in higher salinity sections of the river. This would be a less strict definition of "sea run." In New England, brook trout do something like this and are called "salters" or "sea run." Although they don't necessarily go out to sea, the key is they are in genuine salt water at the mouths of coastel rivers and are feeding on marine organisms. Again, such a scenario is entirely possible in the D. So I suppose, if one accepts "sea run" to mean a population that drops down into brackish water or salt water in the lower reaches of a river.... then, using this less strict concept, I'd be more inclined to believe such fish exist. Browns that migrate up and down river on a seasonal basis don't qualify in my view as "sea run." If they get to salt water, then they can meet the less strict definition (I suppose). Part of this debate is where the salinity line is. I'd guess the salinity line is lower during colder months of the year due to higher flows and this would generally be in the vicinity of Philadelphia. Are there browns that far downriver this time of year on a regular basis? Perhaps. If one uses the less strict definition of sea run, than such fish would meet this standard.
Delware River Salt Line

FWIW - i define sea run as a fish that spends at least 12 months or more at sea like a Salmon/Grilse and Sea Trout/Peel/Sewin or Steelhead Trout.


interesting stuff Sandfly - i have heard of rivers in Europe where the fish hunker down in deep holes during the summer days and hunt at night.

its the same up in Maine - no-one targets them at night and they bitch that they can't catch em. that's cos they're nocturnal. duh.


we don't even cast to them until an hour after full dark, otherwise you put them down for the whole night or they'll move on.

Quote:


utter crap. I lived in the UK for 35 years and have NEVER seen any streams other than the chalkstreams like the Test, Itchen, Ribble etc that have had any improvements made. no rivers are maintained by the UK Government at all.

99% of the best sea trout rivers are in Wales, Scotland, Devon or Cornwall, and vary from rivers half a mile wide to ones you could pole vault across.

they are very wild places - the trick is to arrive the day or morning before, check out access, measure out your cast and figure your wade in and wade out.

i fish the Bandon river every june and we have to walk two miles to the river through woods and pasture.

our angling club of 35 members catch 2,000 fish a year from May to season close in September.

difficult to catch, my ass.

and you don't need to find their hiding places - you just cast at the splashes and hang on

I really want to fish with GeeBee so I can listen to his British accent. Especially if he curses.

Quote:

f*** Off.

no-one curses like we do


i'd love to fish with you guys sometime from March onwards when i'm back home (working abroad right now) - i think i can learn a real lot from you guys.

i think columbus day weekend i might arrange a weekend trip to the manasquan for those sea trout. i'll scout it out this summer.

i'd like to help a forum member claim that 5lb record - and after we have they are damn damn fine eating. grilled and lemon juice. yum.

sorted

I will now imagine you as a cross between a soccer hooligan and Austin Powers. Btw, little off topic, but where do you reside when you are not abroad?

not far from Wilmington.

"not far from Wilmington"

Geebee, I can see it and this may scare you but we may establish something of the "the accent” - lower Delaware subdivision corps of unorthodox unanimity reps with regulations and diversions flows of upper crust Wilmington intergovernmental fishing accomplishment or something,
Shane Bro: I’m very “religious” but don’t take me home with your kids when I’m coursing,(this not happened very often).

Trou are seen all the time on cameras at the Art Museum Dam on the Schuylkill R. I would doubt there are some in the D below the Gap, I here stories about them all the time.
Edit: And you may use big flies and not worry about Tim M's ethics committee beating you up

I'm a Warren Co NJ native and large browns are caught through this section of river down to Reigelsville - although I would say most are by a few anglers that really focus on it. Even then, it is never a numbers game. The tricks seem to be looking around trib mouths in the fall for spawners and finding spring holes in the summer. The summer tactic is to wet wade in areas where limestone meets the Precambrian gneisses and find the cold spots. Delaware River summer temps get into the 80s, so you really need to find the cold water refuges. Then fish these at night and hang on. Not sure if these are sea run fish, but it gives you a shot at a 2ft+ brown. Shad fishermen ocassionally hook a big brown in the spring, but these are by luck IMHO. I've seen the most browns caught while shad fishing the Walpack Bend, but then the Flatbrook comes in on on side and the Bushkill on the other. The people I'm aware of who target the big browns spend more time scouting than fishing. It's more hunting for big fish rather than fishing hard and you earn every fish. One exception was a guy who lived next to a spawning trib (like 50 feet away) and just looked in on his way to work each day - but most of us aren't in that position.

just to add to the contraversy :)
check this out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBsVnplmcG0

That video is how it is when I fish the Delaware. One minute you think you've got a smallie and then you realize it's a nice trout or striper. I just checked my old computer for the pic that I've got of a very large brookie that was caught near Raubsville. If I can figure out how to photoshop the crankbait out of it's lip, I'll post it