Donegal Creek - 'red barn' parking issue

[wgmiller]

If you fish Donegal Creek and used to park at the red horse barn, life has changed for you. The previous owner passed away a year or two ago and the property was sold. A new owner has come in and is living in camper trailer on-site while renovating the horse barn (presumably for living quarters). I met him last spring when I parked in front of the barn (he wasn't home at the time) and he stated that he wasn't going to allow parking in front of the barn. I understood and went on my way after fishing.

I parked on the opposite side of the driveway this morning and fished the creek with TimB. He also parked just down the lane, on the same side. When I returned and was dressing down, the owner came out and told me that no parking was allowed where I was. I asked him how I was to know that given it wasn't posted. We had a civil discussion for five minutes or so in which he stated he owned that land. He has goats and he didn't want them jumping up on people's cars. He said his water had been poisoned in his trailer (he thinks from a disgruntled fisherman) and he almost died from it...

That being said, it looks like the best two options for parking to access the FFO stretch are along 772 (busy road), or just up Donegal Creek Road off of Route 23.

FWIW, a stretch of previously open water upstream of Long Lane has also been posted, although this stretch never really fished that well IMO.

So if you fish Donegal, beware that if you used to park at the red horse barn, you're going to have to find another place to park.

 

[icyguides]

Access is really starting to get difficult on the donegal. It's very fragmented and a lot of the water that was open just a few years ago is now posted. Early last spring i was told by someone, presumably the landowner, along the long lane stretch you referred to that i could wade in the stream and fish but not step foot on the bank. I was wearing hip boots and it's not really the type of stream you can trudge through the middle of and expect to catch anything so i turned around.

If you happened to notice any tires or large refuse in the stream can you please pm me the general location? I'm planning on organizing a stream clean up sometime in the late winter/early spring.

Did you have any luck?...I might do a little trash recon this weekend, with a rod of course.

 

[wgmiller]

PM coming your way. There were a few items from the Wivell farm up to the 'quarry hole' that I saw. I caught a rainbow fingerling, but that was it. Saw some nice fish on stream bottom in a few holes, but they weren't having any of it. A few hard strikes, but too much short-striking. TimB said he caught a healthy 12" bow near the quarry hole, but overall fishing was slow.

 

[dc410]

Geo,

Do you know if the road with the gate behind the "red barn" can still be used to access or leave the stream if only walking?

 

[wgmiller]

John,

This issue is being worked on by the DFCA president. I was able to find a parcel map which clearly shows that his property line does not enter the lane alongside his property or the access road where the gate is. While the parcel map is only a reference tool, the DFCA president talking to the farmer who owns just about all the land around there (including the land abutting the right-of-way) should help.

 

[raftman]

I was told by the barn owner that I was still able to walk down the lane to access the fishing there. However, this was back in October, so maybe his mind has changed (which it has seemed to do quite often since he setup camp).

 

[salmonoid]

I sincerely hope that someone did not poison the guy's water, although there are people who think their "right" to fish trumps property owners' rights. I walked out the lane earlier in the fall and saw the camper, but no one was around that I could see and I had parked farther down the road so I can't speak to the parking situation right there.

On the access that has been revoked off of Long Lane, I'm having a hard time picturing what stretch this is, since the creek doesn't intersect Long Lane anywhere. Is it one of the farms that has a driveway off of Long Lane?

Unfortunately, even if the property line does not include the lane or access road, it's never good if there is an adjacent to a stream property owner who has an axe to grind with anglers trying to access the stream. Angler and property owner goodwill gets trampled in these situations.

 

[dc410]

salmonoid wrote:

On the access that has been revoked off of Long Lane, I'm having a hard time picturing what stretch this is, since the creek doesn't intersect Long Lane anywhere. Is it one of the farms that has a driveway off of Long Lane?

I think they may be referring to the section of stream downstream from route 23, it does intersect Long Lane before crossing route 441. I never fished this section of Donegal but I think it is part of the special regulations water.

I totally agree with your concern for the bad feelings of an adjacent landowner toward fisherman. I hope we can keep it to dull roar because this landowner is going to have the occasion to meet a lot of flyfishermen with as popular a spot that it was to access the stream for many years.

 

[wgmiller]

dc410 wrote:
I think they may be referring to the section of stream downstream from route 23, it does intersect Long Lane before crossing route 441. I never fished this section of Donegal but I think it is part of the special regulations water.

Correct.

 

[salmonoid]

I always thought that the FFO section only ran down to route 23, but it looks like the PFBC map has it going down to almost Long Lane. I look at the mouth of Donegal most days on the way to work, but it didn't click that the posted section was down that far. I've never fished it there; guess I won't..

 

[wgmiller]

Donegal, from the confluence of the Chiques/Donegal upstream to the Long Lane bridge is "open water" with no regs. The lower limit of the fly stretch is the Long Lane bridge. That stretch from the Chiques up to the bridge is very short, but open to fishing. It's quite possible you could find a "lunker" in there that is hanging out at the Chiques/Donegal confluence. The stretch above Long Lane to 23 is relatively flat, featureless, structureless water that doesn't seem to hold many trout.

What would really be nice would be if the dam is removed on Chiques so fish can pass between the Susky and the Chiques/Donegal easily. That could be a game changer.

 

[raftman]

Agree about that dam. Supposedly they were planning on taking that out at the same time as building the rail-trail bridge going in next summer, but the money didn't come through. It'd be great to see that dam removed.

 

[Mike]

This is very concerning to an AFM, especially when social factors are key to inclusion of streams in stocked trout special reg programs.

 

[Mike]

If access, including adequate parking, is problematic and if the stream is shown to support a Class A wild BT population in the future, special regs may not be necessary. No stocking and poor parking will limit angler use and the harvest from small, unstocked wild BT streams in Pa is minimal.

 

[caveman]

I usually park at 772 and walk down stream. One thing that I noticed, and concerned me, was the fence below the dairy farm just downstream from the beginning of the FFO area, has been removed, on the side of the creek nearest the barns. It was not washed away, but removed, posts pulled and all. There are empty holes in the ground. Now it may be there are no cows there anymore with plans to not be in the future. The milking barn seems empty. But it concerned me. If the cows are still there or will be pastured there they will have free access to the stream and banks. Not good!!

The access to the stream at the bottom of the FFO area off 441 has been this way for over a year now. I actually like that section of the stream and generally had some pretty good success there. But this was also when it was stocked.

Loss of the horse barn parking is not good either. I hope there can be some kind of deal worked out. If the guys goats are going to have access to peoples cars then they are not being penned properly.

 

[raftman]

The owner of the red barn has put up a fence recently, so the goat problem should be taken care of. Based on the last DFCA meeting, that area was recently surveyed which clearly showed he did not own the space to the left of his barn and lane. However, it sounds as if he is still acting like he does, so be prepared. I've been parking further down and walking in by the barn and he has yet to make that an issue.

 

[salmonoid]

I parked to the left of the lane by the road last week and had no issues. Too bad there wasn't a way to work out an easement with people for parking in the old quarry. There used to be satellite dishes there but they are gone now. Maybe someone from DFCA should make a contact

 

[troutbert]

Mike wrote:
If access, including adequate parking, is problematic and if the stream is shown to support a Class A wild BT population in the future, special regs may not be necessary. No stocking and poor parking will limit angler use and the harvest from small, unstocked wild BT streams in Pa is minimal.

What has changed that allowed Donegal Creek to produce a Class A wild trout population?

It doesn't seem all that many years ago when it was said to have no wild trout at all. Then a "few" wild trout. Now Class A, or nearly so.

What was preventing it from supporting wild trout back then? And what changed?

 

[geebee]

They've done about 3000 ft of restoration havent they ?

When you look at the open meadow stretches of many Lancs streams its not a surprise that they had thermic issues.

 

[wgmiller]

Any restoration work that was done in the "main channel" was done years ago. There was some work done not too long ago, but it was in the headwaters region (around Colebrook Road). The creek still suffers from runoff issues, bank stabilization issues. Fortunately, it's not receiving a lot of runoff from paved surfaces like Lititz Run does in its headwaters. I don't know the timeline for the Donegal with regards to increasing numbers of streambread BT.