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Water rape

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2009/5/29 16:32
From Nicholson PA
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How much water is enough,Been watching the levels of my local fishing haunt the Tunkhannock creek (Wyoming and susquhanna counties)Did a little looking to see if I could see how much water is being taken by the natural gas industry.Well only found one listing and that was in 2010,It was for 980,000 gallons a day,There are now a least 4 different water pick up locations now.(980,000X4)Folks that is a lot of water and the creek is showing it.X4 is only an estimate I would only hope they are not all that high.

Posted on: 2014/8/6 11:00


Re: Water rape

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2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
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Not taking a stance either way, as that is significant. Just putting the math in perspective.

1. I'd assume 980,000 gallons/day is a maximum, as in permitted amount, not an average, and very unlikely that it's taken EVERY day? Correct? Would help to clarify.

2. At the gauge station, the average August flow of Tunkhannock Creek is approximately 22 cubic feet per second.

3. 1 cubic foot = 7.48 gallons. So that's 164.56 gallons per second. There are 86,400 seconds in a day. Hence, 22 cubic feet per second = 14,217,984 gallons per day. So if this well truly took the full 980k gallons every day, and all of it was upstream from the gauge, that equates to a little under 7% of the typical August streamflow at the gauge. If all 4 of them did, then it's 28% of the typical August streamflow.

Those are significant numbers. That said, even if they did take that kind of volume/day on a regular basis, some basic flow controls could pretty easily prevent any major impacts. You could specify a minimum flow rate where they can extract. Or you could set up the maximum allowable volumes to be on a sliding scale, so that when flow rates decrease, allowed volume decreases in kind.

But yeah, if 4 wells are allowed to take that per day, and all 4 decide to take the maximum during a low water period, the impacts aren't insignificant here.

Posted on: 2014/8/6 11:43


Re: Water rape

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2009/5/29 16:32
From Nicholson PA
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These are just water pick up areas I would say that there are way more than 4 wells being feed from this creek.Its pretty hard to find out much info on this topic at least given the time I have to work on it.I would just hope that some official body of government was at least keeping track.Thank you for the math lesson it does help to put it into perspective.I think I would like to know how many wells are been feed but I am sure it would just piss me off.

Posted on: 2014/8/6 16:23
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Re: Water rape

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I certainly don't know for sure. But its possible what you found were permits for 1 time extractions, or perhaps a couple days. Each corresponding to a single well. While the activity at a drill site is lengthy, fracking is a fairly quick process. Get a permit, extract water, frack a well. Some months later, repeat on the next well.

If thats the case, it still depends on when. Do it with healthy flows, no big deal. Do it during an August drought, then its a big deal.

Posted on: 2014/8/6 19:37


Re: Water rape

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2009/2/10 16:30
From SE PA
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I did some research on some of the water withdrawals a few years back. Many times when a company requests a permit they ask for much more than they could possibly use just in case. Take the permit you mention for 980,000 gal per day. If that is used to fill trucks running to well sites there would be a heck of a lot of trucks loading there. Many of the tankers being used have 4,500 gal tanks. So you would be filling well over a hundred truck loads a day to get to that total.

In other cases they piped the water from the intake to a couple nearby well sites. In those cases once the wells were fracked the water use stopped.

Posted on: 2014/8/7 12:21


Re: Water rape

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2006/12/13 9:28
From Other side of the tracks
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I'm not familiar with that particular stream, but most streams are more impacted by consumer use than withdrawals for other purposes.

That even includes bottled water drawn from the aquifer in some cased.

Doesn't make it right though. Just puts it in perspective.

Posted on: 2014/8/7 13:21
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Re: Water rape

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2013/2/16 0:51
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Am I the only one bothered by the overuse of the term "rape" when it comes to environmental issues?

Posted on: 2014/8/7 13:31
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Re: Water rape

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2011/7/6 12:30
From Ephrata, PA
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Quote:

sarce wrote:
Am I the only one bothered by the overuse of the term "rape" when it comes to environmental issues?


No.

Posted on: 2014/8/7 16:29


Re: Water Removal

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2009/5/29 16:32
From Nicholson PA
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Did not mean to over use the word (rape) just seemed to be fitting.Dont want or need to ruffle any ones feathers.

Posted on: 2014/8/8 10:02


Re: Water Removal

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I can't say I was particularly "bothered" by it this time because misuse of words is so common these days.

Melvin, pillage may have been a more appropriate word.

Posted on: 2014/8/12 14:22
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Re: Water rape

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2009/4/1 21:52
From Johnstown, PA
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IMPEACH COREBUTT.

Posted on: 2014/8/13 6:29


Re: Water rape

Joined:
2009/5/29 16:32
From Nicholson PA
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We finally got a little rain all hope is that some official somewhere is keeping track of water levels,This poor girl is very,very low right now.but the trucks and tanks keep moving.This creek is a major breeding area for smallmouth bass in my area.

Posted on: 2014/8/13 8:24
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Re: Water rape

Joined:
2007/4/8 20:43
From SEPA
Posts: 19
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Quote:

melvinp wrote:
Well only found one listing and that was in 2010,It was for 980,000 gallons a day,There are now a least 4 different water pick up locations now.(980,000X4)Folks that is a lot of water and the creek is showing it.


And yet, when I go through USGS gages looking at every August from 2008 to 2014 they all seem to be within a couple CFS of each other, which leads me to believe if "the creek is showing it" your eyesight might be failing.




Posted on: 2014/8/20 23:31

Edited by gfen on 2014/8/21 0:00:06
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And why not?


Re: Water rape

Joined:
2009/5/29 16:32
From Nicholson PA
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I looked at USGS gauge and your are right,But I could not find any data before 2008 and water removal well intrenched by 2008.

Posted on: 2014/9/3 11:09
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Re: Water rape

Joined:
2009/5/29 16:32
From Nicholson PA
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Just the same old story,another water holding center has been zoned.thats six.

Posted on: 2014/9/22 8:34
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Just trying to survive another day in paradise



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