Register now on PaFlyFish.com! Login
HOME FORUM BLOG PHOTOS LINKS


Sponsors

Browsing this Thread:   1 Anonymous Users



« 1 (2) 3 »


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2006/9/9 17:18
From lancaster county
Posts: 6488
Offline
Quote:
The plot thickens......


It does but I already know the ending

Posted on: 2009/10/9 13:40
_________________
http://cvtu.homestead.com/





Re: Saucon Creek dam removal
Moderator
Joined:
2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
Posts: 9112
Offline
Quote:

troutbert wrote:
Note that in the survey data shown for the McCoy Dam site, it states that only 500 feet of stream were surveyed. That's not very much.

Standard PFBC surveys are around 300 meters.

And the length of stream that had significant alteration from the dam removal might be somewhat a matter of opinion, but it is roughly one mile long (5280 feet.)

Doing a before and after survey of 500 feet, when the affected area was about a mile long, and not including the largest pool areas, means that they did not do a serious study of the population effects of the McCoy Dam at all.

It's too bad that neither the PFBC nor Penn State University did a serious before-and-after trout population study at the McCoy dam site or the West Penn Power dam site.



Troutbert,

Mr. Carney replied to your post and certainly appears to be the right person to contact to share your observations and concerns. Sharing knowledge and data can only enhance understanding, and perhaps make projects such as these more beneficial to the stream in the future.

Posted on: 2009/10/10 7:36


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2009/10/9 21:58
Posts: 5
Offline
The work on Saucon Creek was completed on 10/9/09. There was a lot of wood added to the upper portion of the park. I am happy to report that these structures are holding fish and several nice trout were caught along this stretch as work was being completed.

Posted on: 2009/10/10 22:17


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2009/10/9 21:58
Posts: 5
Offline
Absolutely not true, you need to know what your doing and do it right!

Posted on: 2009/10/10 22:19


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2008/1/11 20:10
Posts: 118
Offline
An individual that has removed over 150 dams across PA made a post on the board.

Of the 150 dams the individual has removed, three have come under scrutiny in this thread. Two of the dams are on Spring Creek, which is one of the best streams in the state, and the other site was posted with a question mark so we won’t debate it.

Despite resounding evidence that dam removal is beneficial to trout (and other fish populations), people questioned the positive effects of dam removal on Spring Creek by saying dam plunge pools were not surveyed, stream survey samples were not long enough, and, I think, in-stream habitat structures are useless unless wide undeveloped floodplains remain intact.

I would guess such insignificant issues regarding two dams out of 150 is a positive thing.

We got a little off track, but the initial point of this thread was to point out the work being done along Saucon Creek. If you haven’t been there yet to check out what has been done make a trip. The engineer and equipment operators did a tremendous job along the stream in an effort to improve in-stream habitat and fish populations.

Posted on: 2009/10/11 12:17


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2009/5/16 21:09
Posts: 88
Offline
Dam removal successes stories:

http://www.tu.org/conservation/waters ... m-removal-success-stories

And dam removal analysis:

http://www.usbr.gov/pmts/sediment/projects/hemlock/index.html

The reference section in the second link provides some useful information. Fascinating study - I'd vote for option C.

Posted on: 2009/10/11 22:10


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2006/9/10 21:53
From Greensburg, PA
Posts: 13629
Offline
There was never a dam built to better a piece of water. Dams are built only to serve people. Never underestimate the power of water. If a dam is removed, eventually (and I am not qualified to determine how long eventually means) the stream/river whatever will recreate its channel and become wild again. Whether it affected fish populations is not a result of the dam being removed but was affected when the dam was built in the first place.

Posted on: 2009/10/11 22:30


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2006/9/9 17:18
From lancaster county
Posts: 6488
Offline
Quote:
There was never a dam built to better a piece of water.


Except of those built by local sportmans clubs or uneducated "stream restorations". Those people think because they created 5 inches more depth to favorite holes they have improved the stream.

Hay Creek comes to mind

You right though tom, i cant think of a real dam that was built to better the ecosystem of a stream.

Posted on: 2009/10/12 22:11
_________________
http://cvtu.homestead.com/





Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2008/1/21 13:28
From South Central PA
Posts: 840
Offline
Of which see:

http://pennsylvaniaflyfishing.blogspo ... on-creek-dam-removal.html

Site also happens to be one of the better reads on the web. Don't know him personally.

Posted on: 2009/10/13 11:08


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2008/11/4 15:20
From Upper Saucon, PA
Posts: 204
Offline
I've been there since the dam removal and it's hard to say there is a difference in fish numbers. It will take a number of months or years for the actual results to show up, since the stream itself needs that time to adjust to the change.

The removal should be a positive thing but only time will tell.

What would make an immediate positive impact is for the current restricted stretch to be changed over to fly fishing only C&R. Too many breeders are being removed, let mother nature handle everything, let fly fisher-persons enjoy our time on the stream, and put fish back for the next person to enjoy.

Posted on: 2009/10/18 10:15
_________________
Tight Lines......


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2008/1/11 20:10
Posts: 118
Offline
AlwaysWading - Have you visited Saucon Creek within the past week?

If you haven’t, you missed some great visuals. Fly fishermen were fishing from the elevated walls along the stream. They were hooking fish, hoisting hooked fish up over the walls, unhooking the fish, and then dropping (releasing) the fish 6 feet down only to have them splash into 3” of water. The C&R flyfishing only crowd down there is having an "immediate and positive impact" on the stream, but I'm not sure it is in the manner you suggest.

As for the three year old breeders in Saucon Creek...they are thriving. If flyfishermen stop targeting spawning fish, if they stop stomping through their spawning redds during the winter and early spring, there would be even more fish to be had, but fly fishermen on Saucon Creek seem to miss this point.

There is no need to make this stream C&R FFO. It is thriving despite the poor actions of the hoards of flyfishermen that currently fish it.

Posted on: 2009/10/21 15:28


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2006/9/9 17:18
From lancaster county
Posts: 6488
Offline
browns breed in the winter and spring?

They Breed in the fall.

I have no doubt your accounts JeffS. But this is the 100th time ive seen you make remarks about Fly fisherman like you hate them. Whats up man? Cant we get a little love?

Posted on: 2009/10/21 15:36
_________________
http://cvtu.homestead.com/





Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2008/1/11 20:10
Posts: 118
Offline
I didn't say browns breed in the winter and spring. I said flyfishermen should stop stomping through their spawning areas in the winter and early spring.

Sal -
You asked where I was coming from on another thread that dealt with polls. You are asking me again where I am coming from in this thread.

I do not hate fly fishermen by any means. I am a fly fisherman myself and I get out about 100 times a year.

Posts on this board are predictable and ridiculously one sided - I simply offer another opinion. Just because someone is a fly fisherman it doesn't mean they are God's gift to conservation and that they have good stream manners.

Posted on: 2009/10/21 16:46


Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2006/9/9 17:18
From lancaster county
Posts: 6488
Offline
I agree Jeff. But try to remember this is a FFO forum. OF course the posts are going to be one-sided. If you gather a group of like minded people, you can predict how most the group thinks.

Im glad you cleared that up, i was beginning to think you hated FFer's. No worries man, and yes i agree with your last statement.

Tight lines!

Posted on: 2009/10/21 17:41
_________________
http://cvtu.homestead.com/





Re: Saucon Creek dam removal

Joined:
2006/9/9 17:18
From lancaster county
Posts: 6488
Offline
Quote:
There is no need to make this stream C&R FFO. It is thriving despite the poor actions of the hoards of flyfishermen that currently fish it.


I will add that your original post is just as judgemental as we are.

Its not flyfisherman in general, its maybe the flyfisherman you saw that day. Thats just like saying bait anglers are ruining our streams

Posted on: 2009/10/21 18:18
_________________
http://cvtu.homestead.com/






« 1 (2) 3 »



You can view topic.
You cannot start a new topic.
You cannot reply to posts.
You cannot edit your posts.
You cannot delete your posts.
You cannot add new polls.
You cannot vote in polls.
You cannot attach files to posts.
You cannot post without approval.

[Advanced Search]





Site Content
Login
Username:

Password:

Remember me



Lost Password?

Register now!
Stay Connected

twitterfeed.com facebook instagram RSS Feed

Sponsors
Polls
Will you be fly fishing this autumn?
Yes 95% (139)
No 0% (0)
Thinking about it 4% (6)
_PL_TOTALVOTES
The poll closed at 2014/10/31 17:56
1 Comment





Copyright 2014 by PaFlyFish.com | Privacy Policy| Provided by Kile Media Group | Design by 7dana.com