do trout eat midges?

[mutzinbaugh]

yeseterday fishing the tully it looked like it was snowing in the late afternoon. my buddy and i were picking them up on # 16-18 standard nymph patterns all day. we always have midges in the box but for some reason are reluctant to use them. we started drifting midges late afternoon and picked up 5 or 6 trout on them. i am wondering the midge is a primary source of food for pa trout and what are some good productive patterns.

 

[daman1277]

yes trout eat midges. i have done well on zebra midges in size 14, 16, and 18

 

[gaeronf]

Yes trout eat midges. I'll pull a Gfen on this one:
http://bit.ly/QweRMu

Probably my top two midge patterns are the zebra midge and the griffith's gnat (tied tiny).

Zebra Midge:

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFAlXG_78Z4[/youtube]

With some variations:

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9jSjEdvvgU[/youtube]


Griffith's Gnat:

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFOTQU9UGWQ[/youtube]

 

[mutzinbaugh]

thanks gaeronf, kind of sounds like all other bugs...they will catch fish anyting but if you know when and how to use em you can crush em.

btw...what i meant by snowing were the thousands of midges blowing in the wind. that was pretty cool.

 

[jdaddy]

daman1277 wrote:
yes trout eat midges. i have done well on zebra midges in size 14, 16, and 18

14 and 16 midges? Are you fishing lakes?

 

[daman1277]

Yeah lake Ontario

 

[tjbirgen]

I fish them with success, Midge Magic by Don Holbrook & Ed Koch is a great resource for tying and fishing with midges.

 

[The_Sasquatch]

I thought midges were 18 and smaller.

 

[daman1277]

For some reason on big water like Lake Ontario for me when I tie midge patterns in 14 and 16 I catch fish mainly fingerlings tho

 

[jdaddy]

On average, lake and pond midges can run larger than stream midges.

 

[pcray1231]

Fish definitely eat midges. Most of the streams I fish the naturals are sizes like 28's, 30's, 32's and the like. I typically don't go much smaller than a 26, though, just cause that's about my limit on being able to tie and fish them effectively. Sometimes it works, other times I'd probably be better off trying to go smaller.

For nymphs/pupa, 22's and 24's is typically what I use.

I rarely "crush" them on midges like you can do with certain mayfly hatches, for instance. They aren't moving far enough and aggressively enough for that to happen. "Crushing" them to me means a targeted fish hitting pretty much on the first decent cast, and getting well into the 20's or beyond in numbers. With midges, it's more of a delicate dance, trying to get it in the exact right lane, timing it right, etc. i.e. I often have to work a pod for a while. Getting into double digits is a good day.

 

[GreenWeenie]

The term ‘midge’ is a generic term used to describe insects belonging to the order diptera, which are two winged insects. The majority of two winged insects are small, hence why everyone thinks midge means a small fly, but that is misleading, as there are large two winged insects such as crane flies, common house flies, and horse flies, which are part of the order diptera, and thus also ‘midges’ under the above definition.

So yes, midges are larger than size #18.

 

[krayfish]

Do fish eats midgesk Absolutely. You can actually get into some very good midge fishing. If you are going to fish the Tully, get familiar with small flies. You can also hit great midge fishing on the limestoners over the winter.

 

[Stagger_Lee]

Have had 2 ffish managers @ orvis stores tell me that zebra midges are like candy for trout and they recommend smaller patterns. Those (smaller) are the only sizes I have purchased and/or seen in the handful of fly shops I've been in.

 

[Fishidiot]

Stagger_Lee wrote:
Those (smaller) are the only sizes I have purchased and/or seen in the handful of fly shops I've been in.

While midges can run in larger sizes and the Zebra Midge fly and it's variants are available in larger sizes.....in most streams in PA trout that are feeding on midges are almost always focused on very small ones. For this reason, most FFers here in PA use Zebra Midges in smaller sizes (typically #20 and smaller). This is also true for the dry fly versions of midges as well as the winged adults are usually smaller than mosquitoes.

 

[Chaz]

Trout eat midges, when there are other bugs hatching too. Most of the midges we see in PA are small from #20 to # 32. Many of the midges are from the family Chironomidae-Midges. Others are members of Diptera.

 

[pcray1231]

If you don't care for entomology and proper names, ignore the following. Just writing to expand and clarify the responses of chaz, greenweenie, fishidiot, etc. None are wrong, but they could be confusing.

Diptera is the name of the ORDER. The common name for the order would be "true flies", and includes mosquitoes, craneflies, house flies, horse flies, black flies, midges, and others.

The term midge generally refers to the FAMILY Chironomidae, which falls within the order diptera. So, midges are a subset. All midges are diptera, but not all diptera are midges.

Within this family, there are multiple genus's, and within each of those multiple species. So the number of different bugs that are referred to as "midges" is quite large. Most are very small, well under a size 20. But there are a few exceptions.

But using the term "midge" to describe a cranefly, mosquito, or housefly would be highly unusual. They may be in the order diptera, but not the family Chironomidae. I say unusual, because when talking about common names, there is no "wrong". Nobody governs these names. I could call it an elephant and nobody could say I was wrong. And the generally accepted names could be argued about, and are often regional. There probably is a place out there where "elephant" is the locally accepted name for a midge.

 

[GreenWeenie]

Pcray, you are correct and that is the issue, the term 'midge' may be applied to a variety of insects. I've always heard 'midge' meant to define any two winged insect and I believe Dave Whitlock uses this definition to define midge but I could be wrong. Also, midge can have different definitions depending upon whether you are referring to the larve of airborne stage.

That being said, don't be afraid to tie midge larve on #10, 3x long hooks, you might be surprised. And the benefit is you can actually see it and watch the trout's reaction to it.

More than anything I've found the right shade of color and ribbing combination that creates the correct sight pattern/illusion under then ambient and feeding conditons works more effectively than correct size but wrong colors but sometimes correct size is important. But mostly it is correct color shades.

 

[FrequentTyer]

pcray1231 wrote:
There probably is a place out there where "elephant" is the locally accepted name for a midge.

Correct as usual:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxorhynchites

 

[mutzinbaugh]

pcray1231 wrote:
Fish definitely eat midges. Most of the streams I fish the naturals are sizes like 28's, 30's, 32's and the like. I typically don't go much smaller than a 26, though, just cause that's about my limit on being able to tie and fish them effectively. Sometimes it works, other times I'd probably be better off trying to go smaller.

For nymphs/pupa, 22's and 24's is typically what I use.

I rarely "crush" them on midges like you can do with certain mayfly hatches, for instance. They aren't moving far enough and aggressively enough for that to happen. "Crushing" them to me means a targeted fish hitting pretty much on the first decent cast, and getting well into the 20's or beyond in numbers. With midges, it's more of a delicate dance, trying to get it in the exact right lane, timing it right, etc. i.e. I often have to work a pod for a while. Getting into double digits is a good day.

pcray, thanks for the info...

don't get me wrong there are days were you just can't figure it out and end up fishing all day with a little truck bed picnic break and only landing 1 or 2. then there are days where you are at the right place at the right time and land 20-30. this past spring my buddy and i had 2 or 3 of those great days... but remember we fished dawn to dark at were at the right place at the right time. that would be my definition of crushing them.

also, i personally burned through 3 30 yard spools, 1 110 yard spool, and am probably 30/40 yards into a 250 yard spool of 2lb tippet. (wow i didn't really figure this out till now that this is around 225 yards of tippet) meaning if i work out a section or 2 of nice water with out a strike i probably changed flies a half a dozen times to figure out color/size/depth...etc. and what worked that day/morning never seems to be the ticket that afternoon/evening or the next day.

that is what makes us go back and try it again! one other note the 3 days off the top of my head were from 3 different creeks: little j, penns, and spring. all during the sulphur hatch.