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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
Posts: 13556
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Yeah, I pretty much ignore the class A list and go with the natural repro list. That said, some of them are duds, and some are pretty good.

But most of my favorite brookie waters are not Class A. In fact, I can only think of one or two that I commonly fish that are class A. In my opinion, holding yourself hostage to the class A list is handicapping yourself and making yourself travel far further than you really have to.

It's true that non class A streams can have very low populations. But also consider that these trout populations go up and down like the wind, and they may only sample them once every 20 years or so. Just cause it was class A quality in 1985 doesn't mean it is now, and just cause it wasn't then doesn't mean it isn't now!

Get the natural repro list. Cross reference it with a decent map, even google maps works for most. Go explore. If you hit a dud, don't go back. If you get into some fish, start exploring the stream to find different areas of it, it may be better up or down, etc.

Posted on: 2011/7/22 12:55


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2009/6/27 23:49
From Pittsburgh
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For me its all dry flies all the time... well almost. 90% of your WT Streams will be no deeper than 3 feet. If i am finding that the fish will not come up then I add a dropper nymph. I never nymph and I seldom fish streamers.

The challenge in this kind of fishing is not finding fish. That is easy to do. Any water that looks "fishy" will hold at least one fish. What makes it difficult is presenting the fly to the fish. As others have said, these fish have the tendency to be spooky. I have literally crawled on my belly in order to position myself for a cast I knew would be the only one to that spot. On both of those occasions I have caught the fish I would have otherwise missed.

Crawling is extreme but not always uncalled for. The majority of your time will be spent on your knees, crouched behind rocks, or reaching around a corner. Think of it as a hunt.

Finding a stream is as simple as pulling over to a likely trickle of water. Worst case scenario there are no fish, best case though, you may find an unexploited gem. So explore.

Buy yourself a DeLorme map and cross reference with the internet. My map has every stream In my region highlighted and categorized by biomass.

Last of all, think but dont over think. If you are not having success go back over what you have been doing, find the problem, and work towards fixing it. But in the end, they are just fish, and their brains are the size of a pea.

Posted on: 2011/7/22 19:54
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2011/3/23 22:10
From Delaware River
Posts: 495
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Quote:

BrookieBuster101 wrote:
For me its all dry flies all the time... well almost. 90% of your WT Streams will be no deeper than 3 feet. If i am finding that the fish will not come up then I add a dropper nymph. I never nymph and I seldom fish streamers.

The challenge in this kind of fishing is not finding fish. That is easy to do. Any water that looks "fishy" will hold at least one fish. What makes it difficult is presenting the fly to the fish. As others have said, these fish have the tendency to be spooky. I have literally crawled on my belly in order to position myself for a cast I knew would be the only one to that spot. On both of those occasions I have caught the fish I would have otherwise missed.

Crawling is extreme but not always uncalled for. The majority of your time will be spent on your knees, crouched behind rocks, or reaching around a corner. Think of it as a hunt.

Finding a stream is as simple as pulling over to a likely trickle of water. Worst case scenario there are no fish, best case though, you may find an unexploited gem. So explore.

Buy yourself a DeLorme map and cross reference with the internet. My map has every stream In my region highlighted and categorized by biomass.

Last of all, think but dont over think. If you are not having success go back over what you have been doing, find the problem, and work towards fixing it. But in the end, they are just fish, and their brains are the size of a pea.


Since you fish dries, what are the top 5 dries you use? And maybe a recipe for one or two of those...

Posted on: 2011/7/22 22:06


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2009/8/12 11:55
From chester county
Posts: 1040
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If you are looking for something simple to tie that is an absolutely killer fly:

Foam ant

They work great for wild browns too. I was fishing a little stonefly nymph this morning and caught nothing but chubs for two hours. I lost that fly, tied on one of these, and fished through water that was basically identical to what I had been nymphing all morning. I caught 3 wild browns in 20 mins after I started using the ant. I don't know why I bother using anything else.

Posted on: 2011/7/22 23:07


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2009/6/27 23:49
From Pittsburgh
Posts: 705
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My go to pattern is a very simple caddis; size 16 hook, a tan dubbing body, and a coastal deer hair wing. There are no bells or whistles on this fly.

Lately I have gotten tired of catching all of the 3-4 inch fish so I have been fishing the Q-Tip. Its more bulky and only the larger fish can fit it in their mouths. It also floats like a cork so its great for dry/dropper. Just work some frogs fanny into the fibers and it will float all day.
Q-Tip

Ill throw a parachute or a beetle here and there, but seeing your fly is key. Anything HI-Vis works well. Try Klinkhammers or stimulators. Like I said finding fish is not the challenge, Its all in the presentation.

Posted on: 2011/7/23 13:37
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2011/3/23 22:10
From Delaware River
Posts: 495
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So even when you see 0 fish rising, you catch fish on dries?

Posted on: 2011/7/23 13:56
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2009/6/27 23:49
From Pittsburgh
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you betcha.

Posted on: 2011/7/23 13:59
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2011/3/23 22:10
From Delaware River
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Wow. Next time I go I will have to try that.

Posted on: 2011/7/23 14:04
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...
Moderator
Joined:
2006/9/11 8:26
From Chester County
Posts: 9061
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Good stuff. Yup, brookies are eager to come up for dries in water as deep as 3-4', which is 95% of all brookie streams (if you find one with deeper holes, guard it with your life).

Any pattern will usually work, but a high floating, durable, and unsinkable one is best. In the summer, I often use a foam beetle or ant with a fluro orange post. BB, that Q-tip fly from Loren W. looks great!

You can fling your fly in tight places without hanging up on the bottom. During tuff times I too add a nymph as a dropper, but it's seldom needed on brookie streams.

Posted on: 2011/7/24 6:59


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2008/1/31 17:19
From Pretty much everywhere at some point, Thorndale today.
Posts: 13556
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Quote:
So even when you see 0 fish rising, you catch fish on dries?


On freestone brookie streams, I very rarely see natural rises, and when I do, it's usually one here and there rather than a steady drumbeat like you'd associate with hatches on more famous waters. Yet, dries are my favorite way to catch them.

Think about it, these fish are opportunistic. They'll take on top, underneath, whatever. If they see food, they eat it! There are exceptions, but thats the general rule, it truly doesn't matter what you use as long as you don't spook them first.

So for the fishermen, the job is to figure out how to get them a fly without spooking them first. IMO, that means dry flies. I can cast them better, fish them farther, hang up less, etc.

Posted on: 2011/7/25 8:11


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2010/1/21 17:06
From Southwest, Pa
Posts: 1069
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Cray,

the streams that you know I frequent always has some steady rising fish, all 3 species.

wild freestoners are the dumbest... dumber than educated stockies.

Last year, I knocked down a flower from a failed cast towards some mt. laurel and a brookie took it in. Those are big flowers, size 2's.

Posted on: 2011/7/29 8:51
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Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets down stream, mend, and wait out each fly swing, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates to the angler to role of butler, rather than nemesis.

-Art Lee


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2006/12/29 10:00
From Harrisburg
Posts: 2013
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An old flyfishing war dog once told me that he believes the reason wild trout hit leaves and debris that fall into the water is in hopes of a bug that may be attached to it. True or not I dont know, but I have noticed since then of trout taking the debris and spitting it out and then examining it. Almost as if searching for a hitch hiker.
Kinda like Letort trout ripping up vegetation and then checking for scuds and shrimp.

Posted on: 2011/7/31 14:07
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2006/9/13 10:18
From LV
Posts: 7749
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For brookies and wild browns on freestone streams, when the hatches are over, I use attractors or terrestrials. On limestone streams the plan is very different, you usually have to match the hatch or fish nymphs when there is no hatch. It's very difficult to get browns to rise whent here is no hatch or a limestone stream.
During the evenings and early morning hours there are pretty steady hatches on the limestone streams or there are spinnerfalls. Fishing mid-day during bright sunny hours is something I personally don't do on limestone streams, unless there are showers occurring.

Squaretail, One fall day on the WB Perkiomen Creek I was fishing among the leaves when my fly landed on top of a leaf, a brown came up hit the leaf and was hooked and brought to hand.

Posted on: 2011/7/31 20:49
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Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2010/1/21 17:06
From Southwest, Pa
Posts: 1069
Offline
chaz,

it's really no different fishing for finglerings that have turned adult in freestone streams that get hatches up there w. limestone waterways. If fish aren't rising, I'm swinging wets, streamers, or a tandem, tertiary rig covering all bases. They are few and far inbetween the state, but many exist. I would put them up there w. the lil j in terms of hatches, especially the sulphurs. Green drakes, for some reason, I find a lot on freestone wild streams, however, it's rare the fish are keyed on them.

square,

that's an interesting theory, and a good one at that. It was surely an oppurtunistic rise, however, def. fits with what you said. There are a few deep holes that I can never get a fish to rise in on some freestoners. I think this year I may actually fish a weighted small bugger through to see what I can bring to hand, however, do view this as a cardinal sin on any freestone wild stretch.

As I said, I have caught all 3 species on dries in the dead of winter when the waters are open; granted, not near as many during the spring/summer. I'm lucky enough to live near a fingerling freestoner/tailwater that never freezes.

Last year, i was in the sitting and watching a bundle of trout rising conjuring up the ambush and waiting for my gink to dry and down floats a barely living wild brook about 5 inches. I could not believe it. This fish floated at least 6 miles as the only trib that holds wilds is this far up. Could not believe a smallmouth or large brown didn't munch down. I tried reviving but to no avail. Upon opening the fish up after it died, I found a small bait hook inside and a bunch of nymphs. Made me sick.

I can see fishing a tandem off a dry in dire circumstances, but fishing subsurface to small wilds is not fun by any means to me. If I am forced to fish underneath, I'll take some chrome or larger browns.

Posted on: 2011/7/31 23:40
_________________
Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets down stream, mend, and wait out each fly swing, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates to the angler to role of butler, rather than nemesis.

-Art Lee


Re: Native Brookies-Nothing Personal...

Joined:
2009/6/27 23:49
From Pittsburgh
Posts: 705
Offline
Chaz,
For the record limestone creek browns can be caught all day on top just by slapping a beetle against the bank. The hard part about fishing in midday conditions is finding those fish that are still active despite the bright sunlight.

Squaretail,
In the Under Water World of Trout it is explained that fish grab nonfood items like leaves out of boredom. He then parallels this theory with how people, as they walk down a path, subconsciously pull leaves off of the bushes as they pass by. I had always thought this to be pretty far fetched.

Posted on: 2011/8/4 20:53
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